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numbering objects

Laughing Larry

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Hi,

I'd would like to know how to number general purpose not living things (no animals nor ppl).

Suppose I'd like to ask: "Would you like 2 glasses of Italian red wine?" is the following correct?

二つグラソでイタリアからの赤いワインわいかがですか

thanks!
 

First off, glass is not グラソ (guraso) but グラス (gurasu)!
When counting drinks in a glass or in a cup, you should use 杯 (hai) as a counter.
Here's the explanation and a list of counters.
Japanese counter word - Wikipedia

Particle wa is written は even though its pronounciation is same as わ.

2 glasses of 二杯
Italian red wine イタリアンワインの赤 or イタリアの赤ワイン
Italian is generally translated as イタリアの or イタリアン (the latter is direct import of English word).
イタリアからの is grammatically correct, but sounds odd when you're in Italy.

Would you like 2 glasses of Italian red wine?
イタリアの赤ワインを（グラスで）二杯いかがですか。
 
Although as a four ? FIVE ?(!) star restaurant, ~~Nippai Ni nasaimasuka? is better for consistency ??

Thanks for the counters reminder. Sake cups/glasses is "ppai." You want to say "~ppon" for a long glass, but of course that's an entire bottle (or two !).
 
so as you said the correct phrase is:
itaria no aka wain wo gurasu de ni-hai ikaga desu ka?
where gurasu de might as well be removed since the counter hai means cups, glasse etc...but what if its was botoru ?? should I change the counter?
thanks
 
Laughing Larry said:
so as you said the correct phrase is:
itaria no aka wain wo gurasu de ni-hai ikaga desu ka?
where gurasu de might as well be removed since the counter hai means cups, glasse etc...but what if its was botoru ?? should I change the counter?
thanks
Click to expand...

In case of bottle, it is 本 - you can find it in the list, I believe.
Gurasu de nihai is OK but as somehow it sounds rather awkward...
(It depends on the situation, but it sounds like offering two glasses of wine to one person.)

If I were to ask clients if they'd like wine, I might say

Would you like Italian wine?
イタリアのワインはいかがですか？

Would you prefer red or white?
赤と白、どちらがよろしいですか？

Would you take a bottle, or a glass?
ボトルになさいますか、それともグラスになさいますか ？


Whispering to Elizabeth:
窶掖 is i-ppai, ni-hai, san-bai...
窶怒 goes i-ppon, ni-hon, san-bon...
 
Last edited:
undrentide said:

Whispering to Elizabeth:
杯 is i-ppai, ni-hai, san-bai...
本 goes i-ppon, ni-hon, san-bon... ;-)
Click to expand...
Yeah, I need to whisper it to myself as well. And minimize this browser to the system tray at work so that no one would notice what I was doing.
 
thank you all! here's my very last question: in the following:

イタリアの赤ワインを（グラスで）二杯いかがですか。

why are you using wo instead of wa ??

thanks
 
Laughing Larry said:
so as you said the correct phrase is:
itaria no aka wain wo gurasu de ni-hai ikaga desu ka?
where gurasu de might as well be removed since the counter hai means cups, glasse etc...but what if its was botoru ?? should I change the counter?
thanks
Click to expand...
Actually, I think "botoru" is the counter ?? To be preceeded by いち、に、さん。。。

I wouldn't use it in place of the 本 set unless you're referring specifically to the physical item per se (そのボトルにワインはあまり入っていない。。。）
 
Because the hidden particle appears when 二杯 is added. 赤ワインはいかがですか actually means 赤ワインを飲む/頼むのはいかがですか. That's quite same that "How about red wine?" actually means "How about you drink/order red wine?" in English. Since 赤ワイン is the object of the verb "飲む/頼む" in the omitted clause, the particle を is used here.

イタリアの赤ワイン（を飲む/頼むの）はいかがですか。
イタリアの赤ワインを二杯（飲むのは/頼むのは）いかがですか。

As undrentide-san wrote, イタリアのワインはいかがですか is far more natural. イタリアの赤ワインを二杯いかがですか sounds like a hard-sell.
 
Because while I've never seen a pattern like イタリアの赤ワインを二杯いかがですか in the real world, a structure of （Aは）numberいかがですか seems like you are trying to talk the customer out of ordering something else. Even odder for what you're trying to say.

Counters are most commonly used in basic compositions of A (は) B を (number) verb or （A に（は） B が(number)ある・いる。

What's the （グラスで）doing here anyway ?
 
Last edited:

well, yeah! the last sentence イタリアの赤ワインを二杯いかがですか is meant more to summarize the order so I am sure I got it right...I'd never try to hard sell like that! thanks!!
 
タリアの赤ワインを1杯 いかがですか。

I can imagine you could still ask this as a general order similar to the English "Glass of wine anyone ?"
 
ok, although I mean something more like: "ok, so you are having a glass fo italian red wine, and you are having 2 glasses of furancu white wine called /chardonnay/"
 
Laughing Larry said:
ok, although I mean something more like: "ok, so you are having a glass fo italian red wine, and you are having 2 glasses of furancu white wine called /chardonnay/"
Click to expand...
Oh, confirming it like "Italian red wine ha ippai to, chardonnay (to iu french white wine) ha nihai de gozaimasu?." ?? Chardonnay is general knowledge so I suppose the description can be left out.

This computer is not Japanese friendly.
 
Laughing Larry said:
so as you said the correct phrase is:
itaria no aka wain wo gurasu de ni-hai ikaga desu ka?
where gurasu de might as well be removed since the counter hai means cups, glasse etc...but what if its was botoru ?? should I change the counter?
thanks
Click to expand...
Tell me if this is natural with "hitotsu."

Customer : Nomimono ha tsukimasuka? Are drinks included ?

Wait : : Coffee ka tea ga tsukimasu. Coffee or tea.

Customer : Hitotsu zutsu onegai shimasu. I'll take one of each ??
 
are the following fine to conferm the customers orders?

シャルドネというフランクの赤ワインは二杯でございます

イタリアの白ワインは一杯でございます

Also, can I use them while serving them?

thanks
 
そうですね。 忘れないようにご注文を書き留めておけば、確認する必 要はないですね。
 
The sentence final particle ね is needed for confirmation.

シャルドネを二杯とイタリアの白ワイン(or the brand name of the white wine)を一杯でございますね。

And it's best that you go on to say かしこまりました or "Certainly" after that.

Laughing Larry said:
Also, can I use them while serving them?
Click to expand...
No. You don't need to say 二杯/一杯, just say シャルドネでございます or イタリアの白ワイン(the brand name)でございます with serving each customer. Or, more simply, お待たせしました; "Thank you for waiting" is also fine.
 
Ohhhh, can't believe I forgot the ね！

「はい、承りました。」 also works like a super polite equivalent of かしこまりました ??
 
Last edited:
Elizabeth said:
そうですね。 忘れないようにご注文を書き留めておけば、確認する必 要はないですね。
Click to expand...

wow this is like a challenge to me I had to find all of the words and I found out a new verb. Having said that I still have difficulties understanding the all gist, is the following correct?

soudesune. wasurenai you ni go-chuumon wo kakitodomerute okeba, kakunin suru hitsuyou wa naisesu ne.

thanks


thank you so much!
 
Last edited:
also, suppose a client say:

sore wo torikeshite, kudasai and I don't fully understand that, can I just confirm by saying: sore wo torikeshite mo iidesu ka?

thanks
 
Laughing Larry said:
also, suppose a client say:

sore wo torikeshite, kudasai and I don't fully understand that, can I just confirm by saying: sore wo torikeshite mo iidesu ka?

thanks
Click to expand...

sore wo torikeshite kudasai. (no "," before kudasai.)
torikeshite = te form of torikesu (to cancel)
sore wo = sore (it/that + wo/a particle indicating object)

Sore wo torikeshite mo iidesu ka?
A simple question to ask someone if it is OK to cancel it.
Sore wo torikeshite mo iidesu ne?
Someone says to cancel it, and this is to ask for confirmation.
 
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