Thirty Years after WWII, Who Won -

I get the feeling my efforts in my number 23 post above, kind of blew up in my face !! Well, so much for the Japanese style of vague directions. . .

Anyway, I have taken note of what has been said, and I think that will be taken care of. . . I just hope now, that the thread can, after things have hopefully be cleared, get back to a little bit more 'on topic' line of argumentation. (leave those cities for the movie industry to destroy and rebuild over and over again)

Thanks folks !! MM

w1ngzer0 said:

...does USA sell military grade weapons to random nations? Or only allied nations?

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Like the Taliban...? They shot down a few Russian helicopters with Stingers and about 100 are still floating around there.
Apparently, the missiles don't pose a threat right now because

U.S. Special Forces and their helicopter crews usually operate under cover of darkness but Stingers can be aimed easily only in daylight.

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Off topic, but the question piqued my curiosity.

THE OFFENDED ARE ACTUALLY THE OFFENDERS HERE AND IN REAL LIFE MAKING THINGS LIKE ALL THESE FRIVOLOUS LAWSUITS AND WHAT NOT, IT IS SO RIDICULOUS. I AM THE ONE WHO SHOULD BE APOLOGIZED TO, FOR THE RIDICULE OF COMPARING JAPAN AS LESS PAR THAN OTHER COUNTRIES.

I find it quite amusing that people of a certain race always want entitlements and when they dont have it they cry like a little baby and cannot fight for themselves and get all upset and throw tantrums. People of a certain race think they are superior and actually have a superiority complex when they are shot down. They find out that their place in real life it is unbearable, and they go beserko and if they don't have the same entitlements everywhere they act like a little crybaby and think they should file a lawsuit or something. They should look closely at themselves and think before they act. When someone mentions something or someone is better than they are, they get all aggressive and bothered. They are always making all these comparisons to see who is better because they are so petty. I dislike that and like to shoot down people and their vanity. People of a certain race go ballastic when things are pointed out about their inferiority and reality hits them in the face. People of that race thinks they are superior than the rest and when things are pointed out that is contrary to their deluded belief about themselves and they find the truth that they are lesser humans, when they hear that they are the ones sub par they go on an ego trip and they need to be stabilized from utter shock once their bubble is burst. They are all paranoid about being the best in the world or something, it is hard for them to swallow, a bitter pill for them.

Some individuals go cry to the moderator for help and cannot fend for themselves and make threats that they will go to the mod without really addressing the issues. I like the moderator because he is judicious but we should go to him when real issues of physical attack or clear abuse is in effect. We should not bother him when people find facts about someone because i can surmise their state of being by reading how and what they write.

Actually the Japanese need to be apologized to even more so than the offended for such a trite offense. We must remember the boy who cries wolf. Some are oblivious to the fact that they are being offensive even if they think it is good natured to be switching the subjects to something else because they know they are lacking thereof in that subject. They switch subjects to something that they think is their strong point but it is not and when they find out, they switch subjects again, it is their hubris and their superiority complex to rant about other things and so likewise i fling questions at their face. They think they are better in everyway but they are sadly mistaken. The world does not revolve around that certain race. It is better to be silent and to listen than to speak out because we will find out the truth by what one says and writes. Actually for all these attacks on me and blaming me for someone's problem that i pointed out is not my fault if they live in a certain way. An apology should be forthcoming to me, by making an apology for causing all this trouble and my time to write to educate the vanity of men. I am sick and tired of these crybaby men that are offensive without even knowing it. they are ignorant and i have to correct them.

I must say I must have pushed many of your buttons. I apology for the ad hominem attacks but you know i said things jokingly. If I have gotten any of you upset i think i told the truth and the truth hurts. Don't take things too seriously, this is the internet. That certain race always thinks they are better than everyone else and that is the hubris of men and their downfall. Yet, shouldn't the truth be told. Many people like to critisize and i dislike those who think they have entitlements and say crude things of places they do not know nothing about and it is very grating on my nerves. It takes two to tango and i also want an apology from those who made statements without really thinking. An apology is due from those who were affected if they are really man enough to make an apology. I am only defending the cause of the Japanese because this is about Japan and this is a Japanese forum, and if you critisize it then i have no other recompense but to tell the truth of the matter and critique people for what they write and say.

I am also new here and will be on my best behavior and expect no less from others here rather than those who easily cry wolf and shout that I be banned. Just because I hit the nail on the head doesnt mean i should get banned for those who can't handle the truth of what i said. I am going to leave this thread so as to not post further comments on this topic because people here went off tangent. Those who offended me should be even more apologetic to me and to apologize to the others who were posting about Japan in a positive light. I am guilty of making rash comments, get over it some of it was a joke.

I said some argumentum ad hominem attack in a jokingly manner and sorry about that but read the truthful statements i wrote and brush aside the jokes. Instead, those that made negative comments about Japan should apologize and then you will have my apology, I have every right to speak out in truth. Let bygones be bygones. DONE.

I can understand, I do believe, your emotions that are wrapped up in your wording and sentences. I think it is important to be resonable, honest, fair, and just--to the best of our abilities. (and of course we do have a range of abilities, but. . . )

As a moderator and team member of JREF, I would like to point out, as you get settled down into the JREF feel, uyoku san, that disagreeing on matters is no problem--we humans obviously do disagree on a world of matters. Also, no one has asked that you be banned, nor did anyone report you at all. As a team member, I simply found, while reading your opinions, a mode of expression that is not JREF material; thats all.

I am very happy to see your desire to stay with us here at JREF, and enjoy the environment and landscape that JREF offers. I thank you, uyoku san, and appologize for the inconvience.

AND...THEN BACK IN TOPIC...

I will again state the in the OP, the fault was the definition of 'war' was not spelled out. I have stated my opinion earlier in the thread, the military institution was became under the command of the enemy at that time, so with that the war (in the normal sense of the word) was definitely lost--although that is really not important today, at all; in my humble opinion.

In the interest of reconciliation:

Don't misunderstand me. I love Japan. I lived there for 5 years, am married to a Japanese person, speak the language and am planning on returning to live there in the near future. I think it is a wonderful country and think of it as my second homeland.

The only thing I intended to point out is simply that I don't think Tokyo is the most modern city in the world. I certainly did not intend any insult to Japan and if anybody was offended by anything I wrote I apologize for not having made that clear.

Some very personal opinions from my part...

Japan lost millions of people, almost all of its cities of more than 50,000 people were severely destroyed, the second most powerful fleet was sunk, and Japan was occupied (I think it was the only time in its history), the use of the bomb (some versions say merely to "impress" Stalin), and currently one of the most important strongholds of US power is Okinawa...

You hardly can be more defeated than that.

(However, sometimes some severe destruction of physical infraestructure could be beneficial, since Japan was forced (like Germany) to replace that infraestructure using the most advanced standards - compare with England).

The initial ocupation with McArthur verified political reform, although the initial US plan was to keep Japan "low"... a position similar with the intention of applying the Morgenthau Plan.

However, seeing the evolution in Eastern Europe, the beginings of the Cold War, the advance of Communism in China, convinced the Americans to let loose, that a weak Japan was a risky thing.

I do not agree that it was "American investment" what produced the material advance of Japan. Rether, it was the acceptance of the Americans to allow the reconstruction of the conglomerates (Zeibatsu, now Keiretsu), of a more dynamic Japanese capitalism. I remember that much of the ammo the Americans used in Korea, was produced in Japan.

Later, the Japanese, with an original "manufacturing ideology", that included things now famous in manufacturing worldwide like SCQ (a system developed by an American, Deming), Kanban, Just in Time, Reverse Engineering... and the education of many Japanese abroad, with the idea of seeing the most advanced techniques in any area (something that the Chinese are doing today), and with strong State interventionism ("Japan Inc.", the MITI, etc)... the Japanese where the ones that did the job.

In my view, it was not that the USA did much FDI in Japan (on the contrary, the Japanese put a lot of barriers to US capital in Japan, since they wanted to develop its own renewed and original capitalism). Although certainly, the USA import of Japanese products, sustained that development until at least the 80s.

Currently, Japan is the 2nd Economy of the World, although its influence around the World ouside the mere economic sphere, is much lesser that the USA today.

Just in the case of a severe economic problem in the USA (maybe due to an irresponsible financial management) we could see Japan as a real number 1 in the forseeable future.

Regards.

I am sorry but you are mistaken, do you know where the biggest metropolitan area in the world is? Damn right it is Tokyo, bigger than New York.

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The real competitor of Tokyo in that regard is not New York .

did you know the biggest military and i say once again military surrender in world history was the americans and british and other allies to the japanese during WWII and hence the Bataan death march.

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Sorry... you do not know much of military history. The roughly 12,000 Americans captured in Bataan (along 65,000 Filipinos), cannot compare with the scale of other defeats in WWII.

I would say that the biggest military defeat was the battle of Byalistok-Minsk in 1941... 650,000 prisoners... or the destruction of the of the 6th and 4th German Armies (plus 4 of its allies) in the Russian "Saturn operation" (800,000 death + POWs), 1942-43.

Calling america a world power why then the stalemate in Korea...

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The USA + UNO arrived to the Yalu... and then they were attacked by 1 million Chinese.

and the lose in Vietnam... small nation.

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The Chinese also lost in Vietnam... in 79s.

go figure yeah world power huh. now in Iraq now one small muslim nation

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I don't give any opinion here. Things could get out of control.

++++++++++++++++++++++++

I am just correcting some things that may spread missleading information and perpetuate incorrect perceptions.

Note: I also admire very much Japan, and what they do with their limited resources is formidable. But first one have to see the things with objectivity.

Regards.

USA and china lost at vietnam

because Japanese soldiers who did not come back to Japan after war made and trained vietnam's army

today, vietnam revalues it
http://web.soshisha.com/archives/vietnam/2007_0906.php

Power of the Yen Winning Asia New 'Co-Prosperity' Is Displacing U.S
Power of the Yen Winning Asia New 'Co-Prosperity' Is Displacing U.S.

http://www.time.com/time/printout/0,8816,501050815-1090825,00.html

I think the problem is not only japan or Tokyo
The purpose that Japan fought has been forgotten?

For the people who live in America. There is a show called "the war" its on KVIE. I've been watching it for 3 hours now. Has different views from different nationalities in America. Very cool show.