Spanking at an international school

As I had written in my previous reply to the OP, this whole thing does not make sense.

I am convinced that there is much much more to the story than the OP is telling us.

What was the point in bringing up the name of the director let alone the name of the school? The title of the thread alone makes me question the true intention behind starting this thread.

In order for the company to seek compensation (i.e., withhold her last months pay), don't they have to take some sort of legal action to do so? Otherwise it seems to me they are illegally withholding her wages. I do not believe Japanese companies can just make up arbitrary figures when seeking compensation.

I will agree with Ashikaga though, it seems we might not have the whole story here.

Maybe I skimmed through the thread too fast to notice it, but was there any mention of the parents giving consent for their children to be spanked?

Without parental consent, some folks are laying themselves open to both criminal and civil penalties. Even with parental consent there may be some problems under criminal law.

What really had gone on at this school, we will never know for sure. All we have here is the OP who claims she was treated poorly by her employer. I don't think we should get into the details such as the issue of alleged spanking administered to the children by the school, etc.

The OP had a disagreement with the school and stopped reporting to work. The school says they would not pay her for the month of October. The OP wanted to know what to do.

I think she has gotten the answer to her question from some helpful advices from FrustratedDave et al.

Glenski said:

Dave,
You do work, well or badly, you deserve to get paid. Julia wrote:
I worked all the working days in October and the conflict came the last day at the end of my working day, so I didn't miss any working day yet.
and
But they told me that they will not pay me any money because of that conflict.
That is way over the top in penalties!

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Glenski, in this case if the OP did a "突然退職" then the company has every right to penalize her for a one sided break of contract, it does not matter if she worked those days or not the has the right dock her pay. The amount is very difficult to comment on b/c every situation is different, but if it were to go to court she could be out of pocket for things like the company having to run ads for staff recruitment and other costs that could be considered the result of her quiting so suddenly. In the end the advise that most places will give is to talk to the company and reach an aggreement that both parties are happy with. So in answer to your question , no it might not be as harsh a penalty if it were to go to court and she loses.

Glenski said:

You do not have to do everything the employer says. Don't do illegal things, things against your religion, things that are harmful to others (including corporal punishment).

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This is difficult b/c I do not know what the situation is on international schools and if all of them are "学校教育法" , gakkoukyouikuhou". I know it is not allowed in public schools.

Glenski said:

Am eager to see what the OP says about corporal punishment being in the contract or school policy, and whether she knew it. To actually be told to "make them cry" is an outlandish order, especially for preschool kids. I'm sure their parents don't know about such a policy, or they'd be up in arms. I know my wife and I would be!
Oh, and if this was a new contract clause, it has to be agreed upon by both parties before it is legally binding.

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Even if it was not in the contract, if it is not against the law and the company stipulates that all rules are to be abided by, then she does not have a leg to stand on. You can't put every action into a "就業規則" ,"shuugyuukisoku", I know b/c I have made one.

Chidoriashi said:

In order for the company to seek compensation (i.e., withhold her last months pay), don't they have to take some sort of legal action to do so? Otherwise it seems to me they are illegally withholding her wages. I do not believe Japanese companies can just make up arbitrary figures when seeking compensation.
I will agree with Ashikaga though, it seems we might not have the whole story here.

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Yes there are channels that can be used, but the majaority of the time the two parties usually settle things amicably and the fact that going to court here is not really looked upon well in society for such trivial things like this. (I am not saying peoples money is not important)

Mike Cash said:

Maybe I skimmed through the thread too fast to notice it, but was there any mention of the parents giving consent for their children to be spanked?

Without parental consent, some folks are laying themselves open to both criminal and civil penalties. Even with parental consent there may be some problems under criminal law.

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Who knows? I don't think the OP would know either by the looks of things.

ASHIKAGA said:

What really had gone on at this school, we will never know for sure. All we have here is the OP who claims she was treated poorly by her employer. I don't think we should get into the details such as the issue of alleged spanking administered to the children by the school, etc.
The OP had a disagreement with the school and stopped reporting to work. The school says they would not pay her for the month of October. The OP wanted to know what to do.

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I agree completely.

FrustratedDave said:

ﾂ
ﾂ This is difficult b/c I do not know what the situation is on international schools and if all of them are "ﾅ?wﾂ校窶ｹﾂｳﾋ?ｧ窶邸" , gakkoukyouikuhou". I know it is not allowed in public schools.

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I agree with Dave and Ashikaga that this is basically a labor-management issue, and corporal punishment (spanking) issue is a different matter to be addressed by the school and the parents who send their kids to that school.

I've googled the name of the school and, if the school is the one discussed in the topic, I think it's not an "international school" in the true sense but a small, juku-style school offering English language immersion for kids--more an eikaiwa than anything else. I highly doubt that Japan's School Education Law applies to it.

Glenski said:

You do not have to do everything the employer says. Don't do illegal things, things against your religion, things that are harmful to others (including corporal punishment).

Am eager to see what the OP says about corporal punishment being in the contract or school policy, and whether she knew it. To actually be told to "make them cry" is an outlandish order, especially for preschool kids. I'm sure their parents don't know about such a policy, or they'd be up in arms. I know my wife and I would be!

Oh, and if this was a new contract clause, it has to be agreed upon by both parties before it is legally binding.

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There is one thing that I didn't tell you guys yet. Actually, I did tell the parents about spanking at that school and the director's orders to me. Some parents took their children out of school, and I think that that was the damage Dave is fearing about.

Anyway, we called 総合労働相談コーナー and they told us that I have to write 請求書 with a demand to transfer the money to my account in 10 days and deliver it to school. If there will not be any action in this period of time, I have all the right to demand official government actions against my employer.
So, I'm writing this paper now.

Let's see what will happen when I'll deliver it.

You may already know, but I recommend such notice should be sent as "naiyou-shoumei-yuubin" (content-certified mail).

Out of curiosity to the OP, how is your housing situation? Is it supplied through the school?

julia_matsu said:

There is one thing that I didn't tell you guys yet. Actually, I did tell the parents about spanking at that school and the director's orders to me. Some parents took their children out of school, and I think that that was the damadge Dave is fearing about.
Anyway, we called 総合労働相談コーナー and they told us that I have to write 請求書 with a demand to transfere the money to my account in 10 days and deliver it to school. If there will not be any action in this period of time, I have all the right to demand official government actions against my employer.
So, I'm writing this paper now.
Let's see what will happen when I'll deliver it.:?

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My advise is get someone who knows how to handle this kind of thing. You should not be writing this yourself.

And I second what epigene said.

Mikawa Ossan said:

Out of curiosity to the OP, how is your housing situation? Is it supplied through the school?

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Excellent point! I was wondering that myself.

Mike Cash said:

Maybe I skimmed through the thread too fast to notice it, but was there any mention of the parents giving consent for their children to be spanked?

Without parental consent, some folks are laying themselves open to both criminal and civil penalties. Even with parental consent there may be some problems under criminal law.

Click to expand...

Just what is the law in Japan concerning corporal punishment?

ArmandV said:

Just what is the law in Japan concerning corporal punishment?

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Given that this is not a "real" school and these are not "real" teachers, then nothing under the education law is applicable so we need not even concern ourselves with that angle. Not sure what the law is for parents, but I am reasonably sure that for third-parties (such as anyone at that "school") it falls under the category of assault and battery, child abuse, etc. All it takes is for one parent to raise a stink and there will be hell to pay all around.

Mike Cash said:

Given that this is not a "real" school and these are not "real" teachers, then nothing under the education law is applicable so we need not even concern ourselves with that angle. Not sure what the law is for parents, but I am reasonably sure that for third-parties (such as anyone at that "school") it falls under the category of assault and battery, child abuse, etc. All it takes is for one parent to raise a stink and there will be hell to pay all around.

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Thanks. I don't believe any third party has the right to strike a kid not their own.

Is it an international school for real or just one that tacks on the word "international" to its name?

I can see that by contacting the parents and their result, you have really irked the employer. That is probably a big reason for their reaction.

Housing. Doesn't matter if you get it through your employer. Law says they can't kick you out without 6 months' notice, I believe.