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Word order: relative clause + demonstrative + noun

Davide92

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Hi all!

I came across this example sentence on gooじしょ:

それは僕が無くした財布と同一のものだ - It is exactly the same as the wallet that I lost.(▼しかし,無くしたその財布ではない)

My question is about the combination "無くしたその財布". Because the word order seemed a bit strange to me, i looked it up on Google and only got one more result, while "その無くした財布" yielded 109. Since both options seem possible, though not equally common, I was wondering what the difference in meaning/usage could be.

Thanks!
 

Toritoribe

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You can find many examples when searching with just "なくしたその".;)
Generally speaking, when the modifying clause is relatively long, the order "modifying clause + demonstrative + noun" is more preferred.
e.g.
装飾を限りなく取り除き無駄をなくしたそのスタイル vs. その、装飾を限りなく取り除き無駄をなくしたスタイル
創世の神がやる気をなくしたその世界 vs. その、創世の神がやる気をなくした世界

Also, there are cases where the word order can't be changed.
e.g.
戦争で兄をなくしたその結果
大切な人をなくしたそのあとで

In the examples above, その refers to 戦争で兄をなくしたこと and 大切な人をなくしたこと, respectively, so その、戦争で兄をなくした結果 and その、大切な人をなくしたあとで doesn't make sense.
 

Davide92

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Thank you Toritoribe-san.

装飾を限りなく取り除き無駄をなくしたそのスタイル
I'm not sure about the meaning here. My best guess is "That style that removes all decorations (that takes removing decorations to extremes? I'm thinking about 限りなく) and does away with waste (superfluous things). Is this correct?

戦争で兄をなくしたその結果
大切な人をなくしたそのあとで
Withouth その I would translate these as 'As a result of having lost one's brother in the war' and 'after losing a dear person' respectively. How does その change things?

I'm familiar with その後で meaning 'after that' or 'afterwards', but not in this combination. To me 大切な人をなくしたそのあとで sounds like something I would express in English using a full stop: "(They) lost a dear person. After that, ..."
 

Toritoribe

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I'm not sure about the meaning here. My best guess is "That style that removes all decorations (that takes removing decorations to extremes? I'm thinking about 限りなく) and does away with waste (superfluous things). Is this correct?
I took it from a google search result. It explains about a furniture brand, so the subject of 取り除き and なくした is the company (or the designer(s)). Also, the nuance of 限りなく is closer to "as much as possible".

Withouth その I would translate these as 'As a result of having lost one's brother in the war' and 'after losing a dear person' respectively. How does その change things?
The meaning is almost the same without その. その is for emphasis or the like, I think.
 
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