Why could Japan become a modern power in late 19th century but others eastern failed?

[emperor]

People said the success of modernization of Japan is all because of a great emperor, Meiji. Really? only his himself a person? My Japanese friends, Sorry for my question, I wish to know the answer...

 

[Maciamo]

No surely not only himself as a person. It all has to do with the desire of a few Japanese leaders (ex-Chofu, Satsuma and Tosa samurai who became politicians) to bring Japan to the same level as Western powers, because they feared that Japan would become a Western colony (it was already a "semi-colony" due to unequal treaties in the late 1800's). It took all the energy of the country to achieve this dramatic political, economical and culutral change.

 

[kara]

Rome wasn't built in a day

As Maciamo wrote, Japanese leaders did great jobs in late 19th century. However, when you compare Japan and other eastern countries at that time, the key factor isn't the presence of several great individuals, but civilized level of whole nation/society.

It was true that during Edo era(1603-1868), Japanese society and technological advances progressed very slowly compared to Western powers, but 1) before Edo era, Japan was one of the most civilized nations on this planet in many aspects at that time(16th century), 2) even Edo era, there were much technological advances in Japan than other eastern countries.

As for China, it was one of the most civilized nations/societies in ancient time. There was 1)best climate/latitude for pre-modern agricultural technology, 2)big river and vast land for large population. But over-maturity or super-growth as an ancient society prevented China from next step. The same went for India, Egypt, and Mesopotamia.

As for fringe countries of China(Korea, Vietnam, Thailand, Cambodia...etc), they had enjoyed good influences from ancient civilizations(mainly China&India) like Japan, but couldn't avoid bad influences from mighty neighbors unlike Japan(you may think Japan as the invasive country in east asia, but...). So in my opinion, the key is the Sea of Japan and the Korean Strait between Japan and Asia continent.

 

[shiningblue]

i am just putting in my own (maybe historically inacurate) opinion here

the western powers colonized China, India, etc. and Japan was afraid to become another victem, so they had a rush to colonialize, but unlike the mainland countries Japan had really nothing to offer in terms of materials to the western powers. So what would motivate the west to try to conquer a strongly nationalistic Japan with little to no reward when they can just trade with them? Thus Japan can get the technology and arms and such to modernize quickly and become a "world power" without real threat of becoming a colony to some other nation.

i could be wrong and i am just deducing the situation with what i know, feel free to correct me!

 

[emperor]

Hmm...well, I think this is difference of SYSTEM between Japan and other Oriental nation, likes China.....
Why the Meiji Modernization succeeded? Why the Hundred-Days Modernization (Qing China Guangxu period's modernization) failed?
In my view, all because of SYSTEM....

 

[Maciamo]

... but unlike the mainland countries Japan had really nothing to offer in terms of materials to the western powers.

Well, good that you ask for correction because it is really necessary.
Japan had as much if not more to offer in terms of trade to Western countries. It had a lot of silk, tea, and many other products. But they just couldn't trade, because the Shogunate had decided to close the country completely to foreigners (policy called 鎖国 "sakoku"). Westerners asked many times to Japan to open its trade in the Edo period, and they were finally forced by commodore Perry. All Western nations trading in East Asia (Britain, France, US, Russia...) then immediately started trading with Japan.

So what would motivate the west to try to conquer a strongly nationalistic Japan with little to no reward when they can just trade with them?

Japan was not "nationalistic" during the Edo-period in the modern sense of the term. First of all, nobody felt "Japanese". Each person felt from their region or (Daimyou) domain. It's only from Meiji that the government tried to instill a feeling of "Japaneseness" or "national identity". It didn't really exist before. Even linguistically, Japan was divided by numerous dialects. Again, the Meiji government uniformised that by imposing the use of "standard Japanese" at school.

It is because of government efforts to raise "national identity" that nationalism grew so strong in the first half of the 20th century. The same is true of other countries "unified" at about the same time, like Italy (1860) and Germany (1870). No wonder they became allied during WWII. All 3 were very nationalistic (extreme-right) and in need of international recogniton for the newly unified nation.

 

[shiningblue]

thank you for pointing out my historically inaccuracies, but let me make another point. True that Japan had items in which the west wanted (i.e. tea, silk etc like you said) but weren't most of the countries getting these from China? Did Japan have any item worth getting that the west wasn't already taking from China? If yes, then ignore the rest of the post, if no...then why would a country want to try to force it's influence on someone who has nothing to offer in return. It is just a smarter policy to trade with those countries and recieve their goods than to invade. Thus, if there is no threat of force to Japan, then they are free to openly trade with other nations, thus allowing their modernization plan to become successful.

Once agian, please correct my ignorance if I happen to be wrong, agian

 

[Maciamo]

True that Japan had items in which the west wanted (i.e. tea, silk etc like you said) but weren't most of the countries getting these from China? Did Japan have any item worth getting that the west wasn't already taking from China?

International trade is a bit more complicated than that. Products are bought in one place and re-sold in another, in order to make profit. During the late Tokugawa period, silver was very cheap in Japan, and Western traders could easily make a lot of profit by buying it in Japan and reselling it in China or other countries. The same goes for silk. But Westerners could also sell their own products (especially cheap textile, because of factories that Asian countries didn't have), and trading with Japan would have open a big market.

 

[shiningblue]

exactly my point...the other mainland countries had resources in which the western nations decided that it would be a worthwhile endeavor to "invade" the country and take what they needed. with the case of japan however, they decided that trade would be a better route. Following the policy of the modernization theory, Japan now had direct (non subservient) connections to the west, with the trading and such. Thus they were able to modernize very successfully while others could not. Just my opinion however, i am completely in your shadow when it comes to knowledge of japan

 

[kara]

Japan was not "nationalistic" during the Edo-period in the modern sense of the term. First of all, nobody felt "Japanese". Each person felt from their region or (Daimyou) domain. It's only from Meiji that the government tried to instill a feeling of "Japaneseness" or "national identity". It didn't really exist before.

I don't think so. You must be correct about Edo-period, but don't forget 白村江(hakusukino-e -663), 元寇(genkou-1274&1281), and 尊王攘夷運動(sonnoujyoui movement-around1852-1863). Whenever strong impact came from oversea, Japanese nationalism flamed up.

During the late Tokugawa period, silver was very cheap in Japan, and Western traders could easily make a lot of profit by buying it in Japan and reselling it in China or other countries.

About silver, Japan was one of the leading exporters/producers(with Bolivia and Mexico) during 16-17th centuries. In the highest time of those centuries, Japan exported 130-170 tons of silver every year, which reached about 40% of the total amount of silver produced in all over the world. It is said that to prevent the outflow of silver is one of the main reason of sakoku policy.

And about gold, Marco Polo(1254-1324) introduced Japan as "Zipangu, the Land of Gold" to Europe. In those days, Japan was one of the largest gold exporters in the world.