What's new

Welcome to Japan Reference (JREF) - the community for all Things Japanese.

Join Today! It is fast, simple, and FREE!

Learn Japanese with JapanesePod101.com

Textbook Translation

Rei Yahya

ぺらぺらになりたい生徒
Joined
17 Sep 2011
Messages
217
Reaction score
0
I originally posted this in the Word or Phrase thread, until it was kindly pointed out to me that this whole thing is practically a book compared to just a word or phrase.

I recently got an Intermediate Japanese textbook and am working on translating the intro for myself, so that I can come to a full understanding of grammar and structure and why things are used.

A「総合日本語初級から中級へ」について
This is the overhead banner. I figure it means, 'About 'Integrated Japanese from Beginner to Intermediate''. At least, I believe that's what 'ni tsuite' is all about...'about'/'concerning'.

B この「総合日本語初級から中級へ」は、「日本語ジャーナル’」にのせた「現代日本語総合講座」をまとめたも のです。

Here's my crack at it. "This 'Integrated Japanese from Beginner to Intermediate' is a summary of Nihongo Journal's 'Integrated Courses in Modern Japanese'."

C 1989年1月号から1990年3月号までの記事を入れました。
My go. "It draws from articles from January, 1989, to March, 1990."

D 1988年に出版された「総合日本語中級前期」にくらべて、少しやさしくしてあります。
This one is much trickier for me. Something about, 'it's easier than 1988's publication of 'Integrated First Term in Intermediate Japanese'.

1 - In example B, まとめ is a word I learned as 'summary', so まとめたもの struck me as 'something that was summarized', is my thinking correct?
2 - What is にのせた in example C?
3 - What is にくらべて in example D?
4 - What's the grammatical explanation of ~くしてあります?

よろしくお願いします。
 

Toritoribe

松葉解禁
Moderator
Joined
22 Feb 2008
Messages
17,184
Reaction score
3,377
In addition to the answers in another thread, haven't you learned ~てある form yet?
 

Rei Yahya

ぺらぺらになりたい生徒
Joined
17 Sep 2011
Messages
217
Reaction score
0
In addition to the answers in another thread, haven't you learned ~てある form yet?

As far as I know, it's the perfect tense...? I asked my Japanese tutor this morning, and she had trouble explaining it. The best she could explain it was pointing to my textbook and saying この本は書いてあります, translating it in English as 'This book is written.'
 

Angel Valis

黒川
Joined
15 Jul 2010
Messages
290
Reaction score
27
Well, and someone will hopefully correct me if I'm wrong, but the adverbial form of an adjective + する is "to make <adjective>". And ~てある in the sense that I know it, is sort of like the aftermath of a ~ておく phrase. ~ておく, in case you don't know, is to do something to prepare.

Example: パーティーのためにケーキを作っておきます。"I will make a cake [in preparation]."

Now, if later on, someone comes along and finds the finished cake, say before the party, they might say:
ああ!ケーキを作ってありました。"Ah! [Someone] made a cake."

~てある implies that whatever was done was done on purpose and so it's more than just a simple statement of fact.

...It's still a bit confusing sometimes though since we don't really have a good analogue in English....
 

Toritoribe

松葉解禁
Moderator
Joined
22 Feb 2008
Messages
17,184
Reaction score
3,377
てある [Grammar] | Japan Forum

少しやさしくしてあります implies that I(= the writer) made the book easier than the previous one FOR A PURPOSE, as Angel Valis-san pointed out. In this case, it means "I made the book easier for beginner learners."
 

Rei Yahya

ぺらぺらになりたい生徒
Joined
17 Sep 2011
Messages
217
Reaction score
0
Thank you both so much! このトピックは今はっきりになっています。:)

It's still going to be complicated to figure out in the future, but this has laid some good groundwork for understanding. When I can I will post my next translations. よろしくお願いします。
 

Rei Yahya

ぺらぺらになりたい生徒
Joined
17 Sep 2011
Messages
217
Reaction score
0
Round two.

A: 初級の日本語学習がかなり進んだ人のための総合的な教材として、毎月書いたものですが、いま、15の記事が1冊の本になるのは、本当にうれしいことです。
It's a lot for me to swallow at once...but I'll try. "I wrote monthly integrated lessons for people who were especially advanced from elementary Japanese study, but now, I'm happy that 15 articles are now in one book." Sorry for the choppiness.

B: みなさんがこの本を十分に活用して日本語能力をのばしてくださることを、願っています。
"I hope that everyone will make full use of this book to strengthen their Japanese ability."

Before I ask any questions...I'll see if my translations are any good. I'm much more confident with the second than the first.
 

Mike Cash

骨も命も皆此の土地に埋めよう
Joined
15 Mar 2002
Messages
16,455
Reaction score
2,254
Isn't all this part just introductory notes intended for the native speaker instructing the class?
 

Rei Yahya

ぺらぺらになりたい生徒
Joined
17 Sep 2011
Messages
217
Reaction score
0
Isn't all this part just introductory notes intended for the native speaker instructing the class?

It's an introduction to a textbook, although it's not a lesson, I find it valuable to my time to take and go through everything I can. It brings me a sense of satisfaction sitting down with anything and trying to work it out.
 

Mike Cash

骨も命も皆此の土地に埋めよう
Joined
15 Mar 2002
Messages
16,455
Reaction score
2,254
It's an introduction to a textbook, although it's not a lesson, I find it valuable to my time to take and go through everything I can. It brings me a sense of satisfaction sitting down with anything and trying to work it out.

I can understand that, but I was just wondering if this is intended for the native (or advanced foreigner) teaching the class or if this is indicative of what sort of vocabulary and structures it is assumed the person starting to use this book will already know. If the former, no problem, knock yourself out. If the latter, you may find it better to go back and do the book that came before this one. That's why I asked.
 

Rei Yahya

ぺらぺらになりたい生徒
Joined
17 Sep 2011
Messages
217
Reaction score
0
I can understand that, but I was just wondering if this is intended for the native (or advanced foreigner) teaching the class or if this is indicative of what sort of vocabulary and structures it is assumed the person starting to use this book will already know. If the former, no problem, knock yourself out. If the latter, you may find it better to go back and do the book that came before this one. That's why I asked.

Ahh, I see! It's not actually the book's main introduction, just a front page 'about' summary. It has nothing to do with the lessons to follow, I was just very interested in seeing how I'd do tackling it. :)
 

Toritoribe

松葉解禁
Moderator
Joined
22 Feb 2008
Messages
17,184
Reaction score
3,377
You did quite well.👍

Just one correction for A. It's 初級の日本語学習かなり進んだ人, not 初級の日本語学習からかなり進んだ人.
ものですが has a nuance that "This(= the contents of this book) is what I wrote monthly for/as integrated lessons..."
 

Rei Yahya

ぺらぺらになりたい生徒
Joined
17 Sep 2011
Messages
217
Reaction score
0
Thank you, Toritoribe, among others for your constant assistance and help and encouragement. Here and there I will try to translate what I type into Japanese, as it is good exercise for me.

I'm beginning lesson 1, finally. It opens with an article called 住宅, which I understand means housing. (私はやっとレッスン1を始めています。始まりは「住宅」と言う記事で、その意味が「housing」だと思います。)

A: 最近、ホテルで正月をすごす人がふえたそうである。
"Lately, it seems the number of people who stay in hotels for new year's day has increased."

B: 年末に家をしめて、家族全員でホテルにうつる。
"At the end of the year they close their houses, and the whole family moves to a hotel."

C: ホテルでは正月の特別なかざりをつけ、正月の料理を出す。
"They set up special new year's day decorations in the hotel and serve new year's day cuisine."

D: 主婦も家事をする必要がない。家族そろってゆっくりすゔす。
"There's no need for the housewife to do housework, either. The family spends time relaxing together."

How am I doing so far? 今まで、翻訳はどうですか?
よろしくお願いします。
 

Toritoribe

松葉解禁
Moderator
Joined
22 Feb 2008
Messages
17,184
Reaction score
3,377
初級の日本語学習がかなり進んだ人
people who are advanced in elementary Japanese study = people who are close to intermediate Japanese study


その意味「housing」だと思います
「住宅」 is already mentioned previously, so は is used here.

Just for confirmation

A)
そう is for hearsay.

C)
"They" refers to hotel, not family members.

Other than this, perfect!👍
 

Mike Cash

骨も命も皆此の土地に埋めよう
Joined
15 Mar 2002
Messages
16,455
Reaction score
2,254
D: 主婦も家事をする必要がない。家族そろってゆっくりすゔす。
"There's no need for the housewife to do housework, either. The family spends time relaxing together."

I believe you have a typo in there. For some reason I see what to my tired eyes looks like a ゔ
 

Rei Yahya

ぺらぺらになりたい生徒
Joined
17 Sep 2011
Messages
217
Reaction score
0
Wow! What an interesting typo, I wonder how I managed that. Through clumsy iPad typing, that's how. Naturally, I meant すごす.

1) Ahh, so if we're still on the same sentence focus, I can use は twice? I had no idea. Still working on the mechanics of は and が. As I will be for a long time...
2) I put the 'seems' there to express hearsay. What word or words should I use that are better to express it?
3) How does that work? As far as I know (which isn't saying much, I don't know much) ホテルでは is talking about inside the hotel. My understanding would be that it's talking about events that occur in the hotel, and not the hotel doing things. Unless my prior understanding is actually correct, and in Japanese it just so happens to work in the way that 'hoteru de wa' can mean 'the hotel [does something]'.

EDIT: While I'm thinking about it, difference between そろって for 'together' and ’といっしょに’? Personal guess is that 'to issho ni' is reserved for saying things akin to 'with me' 'with him' 'with her' 'with them', whereas 'sorotte' works with groups, in this case, 'the family together'. It's hard for me to put into words but it makes sense.
 

Toritoribe

松葉解禁
Moderator
Joined
22 Feb 2008
Messages
17,184
Reaction score
3,377
1)
The structure "AはB、CはD" is often used for contrasting.
e.g.
昨日は雨で、今日は雪です。
魚を釣るのは好きだけど、食べるのは苦手です。

2)
No problem to use "seems". It's just for "confirmation", as I wrote, i.e., I just wanted to make sure the difference between hearsay そう and observation よう.

3)
ホテルで(は) indicates the locatin, as you understand correctly. The subject ホテル / 従業員が is omitted in the sentence.


そろって and 一緒に are basically the same, but there is another member(the subject in most cases) in ~と一緒に.

二人そろって出かけた。 = 二人一緒に出かけた。
We/They two went out together.

二人と一緒に出かけた。
I went out with both of them.
 

Rei Yahya

ぺらぺらになりたい生徒
Joined
17 Sep 2011
Messages
217
Reaction score
0
Thank you!

A: その理由はいくつかある。主人も主婦もいそがしくて、正月の準備ができない場合もある。
There are several reasons. Both the husband and the wife are busy and can't prepare for New Year's Day.

B:正月の伝統的な行事がきらいな人もある。正月に大ぜいの客が来るので、会うのがめんどうだと思う人もある。
There are also some people who dislike traditional events. Since a lot of guests come for New Year's Day, there are also people who think meeting is troublesome.

I'm probably off here and there and everywhere.
 

Rei Yahya

ぺらぺらになりたい生徒
Joined
17 Sep 2011
Messages
217
Reaction score
0
Really? Wow! That was certainly unexpected on my part.

This 'いくつか'...the definition I saw was 'many/several'. Could その理由はたくさんある also work?
 

Mike Cash

骨も命も皆此の土地に埋めよう
Joined
15 Mar 2002
Messages
16,455
Reaction score
2,254
いくつか doesn't always mean a large number, so it wouldn't necessarily be interchangeable with たくさん in all cases. Essentially, it just means "more than one", since anything other than the singular is covered by いくつか, though one would normally presume a number larger than two, since it would be just as simple to go ahead and list the two items explicitly rather than to use this abbreviating technique.
 

Toritoribe

松葉解禁
Moderator
Joined
22 Feb 2008
Messages
17,184
Reaction score
3,377
いくつか usually CAN'T mean "many". The nuance is more likely close to "a few" than "many". Maybe what you saw was いくつ?
 

Rei Yahya

ぺらぺらになりたい生徒
Joined
17 Sep 2011
Messages
217
Reaction score
0
Thank you both for your replies.

いくつか usually CAN'T mean "many". The nuance is more likely close to "a few" than "many". Maybe what you saw was いくつ?

Strange, it's definitely いくつか. :? Here we go:

A: むかしは、正月にはいつもよりきれいな物を着て、いつもよりぜいたくな料理を食べ、遠くから親せきの人が集まって、にぎやかに話し合った。
In the past, on New Year's day people would dress in pretty clothes, eat luxurious foods, relatives from far away would gather, and have lively conversation.

B: 子供たちも、正月には特別にお金をもらって、好きな物を買うことができた。正月は、「いつも違う」ぜいたくをするときであった。
The children also would recieve special money on new years and could buy things they liked. (the second half I am unsure about but I gather something about 'was a luxurious time'?)

C: そのためには家じゅうをよく掃除し、正月のための特別のかざりをつけた。家を大切にしたのは、家が生活の場所だったからである。
For that reason the whole house would be cleared well, and special decorations for new years day would be put up. Special attention would be payed to the house, because the house was the place of living.
 

Toritoribe

松葉解禁
Moderator
Joined
22 Feb 2008
Messages
17,184
Reaction score
3,377
A)
いつもより: more ~ than usual

B)
Isn't it いつも違う?

C)
👍
 

Rei Yahya

ぺらぺらになりたい生徒
Joined
17 Sep 2011
Messages
217
Reaction score
0
I'll have to double check my book whether or not it's いつも違う or いつもと違う. I'm pretty sure it was the first...but I may be wrong. The meaning falls flat on me though, what does it mean? :? Even after that, I'm still a little stuck on the overall meaning of the second sentence.

Since this is all an article, I understand some of the wordplay and whatnot will differ from conversation. The focus marker は bounces around a lot, such as むかし、正月に... As far as I know, in a normal conversation, this would imply jumping from focus to focus kind of sporadically...then again, I don't know much to start with.

This "家を大切にしたのは" what does it mean to have '~ta NO WA'? I don't know why it's done.
Also, sometimes I wonder, why is it that sometimes the ~te form will be used in a sort of 'and...' way, and sometimes instead of a ~te form it'll just be the root of the verb? What I mean is: "正月にはいつもよりきれいな物を着て、いつもよりぜいたくな料理を食べ..." why not 'kite...tabete' or 'ki...tabe'?
 
Top Bottom