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plain form (だから しないって ・ フラれるのか)

raikado

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Hello,

1) Context: There is this Yotsuba chapter where Fuuka gets depressed because she sees the boy she likes going out with another girl. Yotsuba tries to console her. At some point she asks if she has already kissed someone and Fuuka says no. After that, Fuuka tells her she has received love letters before, Yotsuba gets excited and asks again if she kissed with that boy.

よつば:ふーかはもうチューしたか?
風香:・・・してない
[...]
よつば:チューした!? そいつとチューした!?
風香:だから しないって 
   お断りしたから ごめんなさいって

Why did she change from してない to しない? And why can she answer the second question with しないって, even though the question was past tense, チューした?
My guess is that the focus is only on the fact that she already said "no" before (the negative form of する), without any regard to the tense.


2) A bit after that, Yotsuba goes to Asagi and Torako and tells them what happened.

トラ子:風香ちゃん あんだけかわいくてもフラれるのか・・・

I think she uses the plain form here because "the speaker still suffers from what was/has been done even now", except it's not the speaker but someone from the speaker's group (just like くれる is used when the speaker or someone in the speaker's group receives a favor). Is this correct?
 

Majestic

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She could have repeated the same word (してない) and it would have been fine. Changing to しない turns it slightly into, "I wouldn't do that", giving it more finality. If she answers a past tense question with a past tense negative answer, it leaves the door open for a future change to positive. "I didn't kiss him then (but I may do so in the future)".


フラれた is what happened to Fuka (passive voice). She got dumped. That form is used because these girls are all friends or peers or generally in some situation that doesn't require more polite speech. She could have used フラれました but it makes the situation sound formal all of a sudden.
 

raikado

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She could have repeated the same word (してない) and it would have been fine. Changing to しない turns it slightly into, "I wouldn't do that", giving it more finality. If she answers a past tense question with a past tense negative answer, it leaves the door open for a future change to positive. "I didn't kiss him then (but I may do so in the future)".
I see, so that's what it was. Thank you very much!

フラれた is what happened to Fuka (passive voice). She got dumped. That form is used because these girls are all friends or peers or generally in some situation that doesn't require more polite speech. She could have used フラれました but it makes the situation sound formal all of a sudden.
Sorry, but she said ふられる, not ふられた. She uses ふられる, even though she is talking about a past event. That's the main point of my question. I've seen similar sentences before and Toritoribe said that the plain form can be used when "the speaker still suffers from what was/has been done even now".

I wanted to verify 2 things with that sentence. Firstly, is this an example of "the speaker still suffers from what was/has been done even now"? Secondly, does this usage apply to the speaker's group as well? ("the speaker or the speaker's group still suffers from what was/has been done even now")
 

Majestic

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The speaker in this case is just saying (rhetorically), "even a cute girl like that can get dumped".
There is no extrapolation to a bigger group. The comment is specific to "even a cute girl like that".
 

raikado

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That's not what I meant with the group thing, but forget about it for now.

The speaker in this case is just saying (rhetorically), "even a cute girl like that can get dumped".
You mean that she is not talking about Fuuka specifically? Hmm...I didn't think of that.


To me, the fact that she says 風香ちゃん at the beginning, seems like the sentence means "Fuuka chan, even though she is so cute she got rejected....?". Which begs the question, why is she using ふられる instead of ふられた or ふられてる when the fact that she got rejected happened in the past?

Some time ago, I asked about まったく・・・なんてことしてくれるの? (#5 from HERE) I couldn't understand how this could mean "What a lovely thing you have done for me!", even though くれる is used and not くれた or くれている. Toritoribe explained it as
"The speaker still suffers from what was/has been done even now" is the reason why くれる/くれてる can be used
So, going back to トラ子:風香ちゃん あんだけかわいくてもフラれるのか・・・ . I thought that the reason why ふられる can be used here is because Fuuka got rejected and she still suffers from that.


EDIT: But if she is not talking about Fuuka specifically, and just generally saying "even a cute girl like that can get dumped", then the use of ふられる makes sense.
 

Majestic

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She is talking about Fuuka, Fuuka, so cute, and yet she still gets dumped. Fuuka is still in the condition of "having been dumped", therefore she is still suffering from that condition - so yes フラれる is appropriate for that. But I will leave it to Toritoribe-san to comment on whether this situation is identical to the other thread.
 

Toritoribe

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1)
してない is just talking about the past event, whereas しない implies her will, so it's like "I didn't" vs. "I won't/wouldn't", as Majestic-san translated.

2)
The past form フラれた is just talking about the past event also here. The nuance of the present form あんだけかわいくてもフラれる is close to あんだけかわいくてもフラれることもある (it could happen that~). It's not the same as なんてことしてくれるの.
 
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