What's new
Learn Japanese with JapanesePod101.com

Pesky Particles: で versus に

Welcome to our Japan community!

A discussion forum for all Things Japanese. Join Today! It is fast, simple, and FREE!

xminus1

Sempai
Donor
Joined
27 Apr 2018
Messages
166
Reaction score
20
Here are two 文法チェックシート sentences I recently encountered in my 書いて覚える Minna workbook:

小川さんは本社 [ で・に ] 転勤します。​
家族は東京 [ で・に ] 残ります。​

The correct answer is に for both sentences. I chose に for the first sentence but で for the second. Perhaps my reasoning for に in the first sentence was wrong and I just stumbled into the right answer.

At any rate, what is the best explanation for the use of に here? Or is the usage more or less idiomatic, and it's just easier to memorize the verbs that take に in their constructions, like [place + に + あります/います] and [from giver/to receiver] with the verbs もらいます/あげます?

Thank you for your help!
 

Toritoribe

松葉解禁
Moderator
Joined
22 Feb 2008
Messages
17,791
Reaction score
3,994
に indicates "destination" in the first sentence. 転勤する or verbs of the similar usage connote a sense of "direction", and に is often interchangeable with へ.
e.g.
向かう
引っ越す
帰る
戻る
運ぶ
置く

As for the second one, I think it's close to the location of existence, as same as いる/ある.
 

xminus1

Sempai
Donor
Joined
27 Apr 2018
Messages
166
Reaction score
20
Hi, Toritoribe-san; thanks for your very useful information. That's a good list of direction-connoting verbs that take に to indication destination.

For the second sentence, your explanation is quite enlightening. I originally chose で to complete the sentence, thinking で here would express "at ___ location", but thinking 残る is similar to the sense of いる is a very helpful interpretation, and one I"ll try to remember to solve future particle puzzles.

Thanks again!
 

Buntaro

運動不足
Joined
27 Dec 2003
Messages
2,154
Reaction score
932
xminus1

I call it "motionless action". To be somewhere, or be 'remaining somewhere' are examples of this "motionless action" that I am speaking of. These examples of "motionless action" take に.

Other examples are "live in Japan" (Nihon に sundeimasu) and "be sitting here" (koko に suwatteimasu).
 

xminus1

Sempai
Donor
Joined
27 Apr 2018
Messages
166
Reaction score
20
Thanks, Buntarosan. I like grammatical tags like the kind you suggested. You gave two good examples for me to remember. Thank you. 🙏
 

Toritoribe

松葉解禁
Moderator
Joined
22 Feb 2008
Messages
17,791
Reaction score
3,994
It's inappropriate to use ~ている form for checking whether the action is "motionless" (or "stative") or not. It can't explain why で is used for 教室で椅子に座っている. に is usually interpreted to indicate the destination of the action for 座る.
 
Top Bottom