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IRAQ Study Group, Wish-Washy Much

TuskCracker

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IRAQ Study Group, Wish-Washy Much

Ideas were watered down to make everyone happy

No real answers, just re-hash of "pie-in-the-sky" solutions, that are joke in reality

Design by committee

Again, % 90 baloney ideas, that sound great on paper, are a joke in the battlefield
 

TuskCracker

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Re:IRAQ Study Group, Wishy-Washy Much

In 1940 the United States new how to win wars. Today United States is a joke.

IRAQ has
- - -> no jungle,
- - -> no nationalistic hero that unified the enemy, like HO CHI MINH,
- - -> no great powers helping the enemy, like Russia or China helping North Vietnam


We still lose. Bush/Cheney are a joke
.
 

ArmandV

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Taking to Iran or Syria sounds like a "feel-good" idea. Those people have no interest in cooperating.
 

Duo 9

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Or, maybe we lost because all you democrats do is piss and moan... the invasion of Japan that would have inevitably happened in World War II was estimated to have ended up with about one million casualties. Then we nuked them. Do you want us to nuke Iraq, too, and then occupy them for 50+ years? We really know how to win now, if you ask me, the terrorists just don't know how to surrender because they are fueled by religion. We hit them before they could hit us AGAIN!
 

Mycernius

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These two threads have been merged, put into chit-chat and have the double posts removed. Once is enough and seeing it was Iraq/US related it did not belong in the Japanese news forum.
 

MajideSaiaku

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America cant win simply because it doesnt have the resources and time, or is unwilling, to spend them to secure a nation with a highly factionalised society.

We topple the one guy filling the power-vacuum, then, try and fill it with our pretty small army by occupation standards, coupled with the high factionalisation of the local population, no wonder Iraq is in the state it is in.

America isnt winning not only because of total lack of competent planning and willingness to pay high for it, but most of all because America might think its top-dog of alot of things, but it doesnt hold monopoly on human nature.

If group A wants to kill group B, and you dont hold absolute control over them, then their going to kill each other, regardless of all the fantastical dreams and fantasies you have for the place.

Willpower doesnt win wars or build cities, resources, time and effort do.

The question boils down to this; Who wants the win more?.

An America that invaded for very shakey reasons, without consensus of the entire political structure of the nation, and with pitiful planning and provision for an effective occupation, or the locals who dont have to do much at all to acheive their goals?.

America is occupying a distant country with little to no observable benefits for the country.

The iraqi's are fighting for various reasons, mostly being percieved threats on their way of life, and when people sincerely feel their way of life is threatened, they get very defensive about it.
 

sabro

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Perhaps we need a Iraq-America Subfora?

Invading other countries is a bad idea unless you have a really really good reasons.
 

godppgo

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The United States can't win because it lacks a clearly defined deliverable long term objective. In other words, the current administation does not have a clear idea as to what is it that the United States wish to achieve(or gain) from occupying Iraq. Be it oil or increase US influence in the middle east, this administration went to war without the end in mind. The Iraq Study Group should focus more on establishing the goals/objectives of this current occupation rather than finding quick fix to the surface when the problem originated from the core.
 

sabro

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The report does clearly state that the current policy has failed.

Solutions are not likely to get through to this administration.
 

craftsman

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I'm a bit lost. Can someone please tell me what is meant by the term 'win' or 'lose' here?
 

sabro

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That is one big problem: absolutely no indication of what "win" means.
 

kamaru

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The United States can't win because it lacks a clearly defined deliverable long term objective.
They actually lack an objective in the first place ! Weapons of mass destruction .. please, who do they think they're bluffing ..?
 

kamaru

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That's bascially why the United States' losing the war. They don't know why they are in Iraq.
Actually they know why they're there and it sure isn't because of "world peace threatening weapons" nor terrorism , they're just hiding behind these so called "protecting the world from terrorism" objectives. I don't consider the death of thousands of iraqis and 2000+ soldiers an accomplishment ...
 

Goldiegirl

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The problem now is what will be left if the US (and others) just backs out. The country could end up in worse hands than Saddam. I don't have the answers, I don't think it's a war of win or lose for the US per se. I just don't think you can abandon Iraq. Iraq is a divided nation that doesn't want peacefull coexistence with it's factions. One faction wants power (under the guise of religion) over the other. A civil war has already started...it's sad, but what is best...just leave and wish them good luck...stay and get killed...get some more countries involved. I would wish peace for the countries of the Middle East, but peace is something that area has never had and I just don't see it happening in the near future. That is truly sad.
 

godppgo

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Actually they know why they're there and it sure isn't because of "world peace threatening weapons" nor terrorism , they're just hiding behind these so called "protecting the world from terrorism" objectives. I don't consider the death of thousands of iraqis and 2000+ soldiers an accomplishment ...

So why do you think the US is in Iraq now?

You are kidding right? Of course you are, you can't be serious! I mean since when could anyone from Canada advise anyone on how to fight a war? :)

What criteria do you consider necessary for someone to have an opinion on the war in Iraq?
 
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Ma Cherie

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There wasn't an objective from the beginning. It seems the Bush Administration went with their gut about WMD's. Since the invasion, the reasons for going to war have changed. Like, "we went there because Saddam had WMD's" Didn't find any. Or, "we went there because Saddam is an evil dictator." Strange, our governement were the ones who had put him in power. "We're trying to spread freedom and democracy in the Middle East." There is so much wrong with that statement. "Saddam was connected to 9-11." He wasn't.

So, the Bush Administration has to continue to find justifications for the war in Iraq. And those damn think tanks, made stupid predictions!!! Like "we'll be greeted as liberators." The whole world hates us now! :eek: "There won't be a civil war in Iraq." Well, look what's happening. Did you know that the Bush Administration didn't know there was the Sh'ias and Sunnis? :eek:

I could go on, but what's the use? :(
 

Duo

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I'm sorry you all I had to cut out the part of the Canadian soldiers comment, I was responsible for that digression as well. My apologies. Shall we get back on the topic........ :)
 

TuskCracker

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In 1940 the United States new how to win wars. Today United States is a joke.

IRAQ has
- - -> no jungle,
- - -> no nationalistic hero that unified the enemy, like HO CHI MINH,
- - -> no great powers helping the enemy, like Russia or China helping North Vietnam

I think you mean 1941 (December-07,1941 Pearl Harbour)
 

TuskCracker

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Then we nuked them. Do you want us to nuke Iraq, too, and then occupy them for 50+ years?


Already Seymour Hersch has reported the USA Pentagon has plans to use tatical nukes against IRAN (I-R-A-N) on underground bunkers that are part of their development of Nuclear Bombs

NEW YORKER MAGAZINE (2006-04-17)
 

TuskCracker

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This article I believe you are talking about


THE IRAN PLANS
Would President Bush go to war to stop Tehran from getting the bomb?
by SEYMOUR M. HERSH
Issue of 2006-04-17
Posted 2006-04-08
 

Duo 9

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Ok, geniuses. No offense, but some people just need to think things through. There is NO WAY that any country, especially my country, would get away with using nukes on Iran, or anywhere else. There is just no justifiable reason, there would be no talking your way out of the environmental problems, the devastation, and the Geneva regulations. Lets think before we speak, huh?
 

kamaru

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there would be no talking your way out of the environmental problems, the devastation, and the Geneva regulations. Lets think before we speak, huh?

You are absolutely right. The US would never use nuke power to end wars, it would do it peacefully just like Hiroshima and Nagasaki ...
The world system today is blinded by power , any country would do anything to take control ... nuke weapons should be abolished in the first place ..
🌹 Peace, too ideal too unreal 🌹
 
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