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If you take the train to the park from here, you (will) have to change three times.

hirashin

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Dear native English speakers,
would both sentences have the same meaning in each case?
1
(a) I have to arrive at Kyoto Station at eight in the morning tomorrow.
(b) I'll have to arrive at Kyoto Station at eight in the morning tomorrow.

2
(a) If you take the train to the park from here, you have to change three times.
(b) If you take the train to the park from here, you will have to change three times.

Thanks in advance.

Hirashin
 

Habaek

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Dear native English speakers,
would both sentences have the same meaning in each case?
1
(a) I have to arrive at Kyoto Station at eight in the morning tomorrow.
(b) I'll have to arrive at Kyoto Station at eight in the morning tomorrow.

2
(a) If you take the train to the park from here, you have to change three times.
(b) If you take the train to the park from here, you will have to change three times.

Thanks in advance.

Hirashin
"I have to be at Kyoto Station by eight in the morning" is more natural
but if you're talking about say Airport it would make sense to use arrive.

cuz arrive = overemphasizing
 

johnnyG

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They are all fine they way they are--no changes/editing needed.
 

Michael2

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I wouldn't say 1b was alright. I wouldn't use "will have to" for near-future/virtually-present plans, unless it was conditional on something, i.e "I have to do my English homework tonight"/"I was going to finish my English homework tomorrow night but that party's on so I'll have to do it tonight.", just like one way you normally use "will", for immediate decisions.

2a and b might be fine but the nuance is different, 2a is a simple statement of fact, 2b would be in a situation where you are explaining a route to someone else, possibly giving a warning or advice.
 

hirashin

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Oh, it seems that opinions are split. I'd be happy if some other natives would give their opinions, too.
 

Lothor

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Oh, it seems that opinions are split. I'd be happy if some other natives would give their opinions, too.
Both johnnyg and Michael2 are correct.
There is nothing wrong with any of the sentences and if a student gives you any of them, mark it correct. As Michael2 says, the 'will' is used more commonly when the journey is going to be a tough one.
Do you know the Seishun18 train ticket? The one where you can travel as much as you like but stay on local trains, which is much cheaper but more arduous than using the Shinkansen for long distances. I could imagine the following conversation.

"I'm travelling from Tokyo to Hiroshima tomorrow using the Seishun18 train ticket."
"You'll have to get up very early to do that!"
"I know. I've set the alarm clock for 4.30am."

Since you are an English teacher, I think this is useful for you to know, but I think it is unrealistic to try to teach this nuance to the vast majority of high school students.

Hope this helps.
 

Habaek

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Oh, it seems that opinions are split. I'd be happy if some other natives would give their opinions, too.
Like Lothor said there's nothing wrong.

The problem is significant
For example "I have to arrive at my bed nine in the evening" this sentence is correct as well
but would you use it?

I remember I had a classmate who is a special needs person who would often time use the word arrive.
"I have arrived at x". He has a speech impairment.
 
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Habaek

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Let me explain why I'm stressing this even it seems irrelevant
Even when sentences are correct, there is a difference

Say I'm speaking to my superior
I would use

"be there at eight"

but if I no longer want to be on good terms with him, or wishing to be terminated.
I would keep using sentences such as

"Will be arriving at xstation at eight in the morning tomorrow"
"I will arrive at xstation at eight in the morning tomorrow"



Because my boss does not serve me, therefore I do not speak to him in such manner.
Also it sounds stupid. Speak English properly > correctly.
 
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hirashin

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Thank you for the help, Lothor.

Habaek, your English is not as good as native speakers'. I'm glad that you are trying to help me, but please don't confuse me.
 

Habaek

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Thank you for the help, Lothor.

Habaek, your English is not as good as native speakers'. I'm glad that you are trying to help me, but please don't confuse me.
Sorry if I confused you, you are right you should ask for advice from robot sensei Lothor.
Teach you English in the form people would use two centuries ago.


My English might be incorrect, but I'm also assimilated into western society as a citizen here.
 
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