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chotto and usage.

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dark_secrester

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Hi,
From a CD i have, I interperet 'choto' (is it choto or chouto?) as 'a little bit too' or 'rather (as in rather small (choto chiisai).
Am I correct? If not, could somebody give me a pointer in the right direction.
Also, would this sort of sentence be allowed (if the above is correct)?
watashi no choto/chouto chiisai inu desu.
Its my rather small dog.
Thanks for any help
Joe
 
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nice gaijin

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ちょっと is romanized "chotto." Your sample sentence looks alright, though it could perhaps use a subject, as in "kore wa watashi no..."
 

yukio_michael

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You can also use it colloquially to ask a person to wait, instead of saying chotto matte, (-te form of materu), you can simply say chotto, chotto... or chotto, kudasai... which is more polite.

a common phrase for ME is chotto dekiru... el oh el...
 

Glenn

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Matte is the -te form of matsu, not materu. (Technically it's also the -te form of mau as well)
 

yukio_michael

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Matte is the -te form of matsu, not materu. (Technically it's also the -te form of mau as well)
Materu is "wait"... I guess I thought that was the meaning of chotto matte ALL THESE YEARS... what is matsu...? Oh now I'm confused!

While I'm at it, when you say something like zuto matta ?? (wait forever...) how do that figure into this?! he;lp

Sorry for my ignorance.
 

Tomii515

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matsu = to wait :3 yay I'm smart... i actua;lly know that word... o_o

And would "materu" -te form be "matete"? o_o
 

Glenn

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Yes, matsu is "wait." Materu is "can wait." And yes, Tomii, the -te form of materu would be matete. Matte is the -te form of matsu, like I said, and it can be used to mean "wait (up)" or "hold on."

Zutto matta in most contexts would mean "I waited forever (lit. for quite a while/a long time)," although there are times when you can use the past form of a verb as a command, like chotto matta! or doita! doita! ("out of my way!"), but I'm not clear on the conditions when using it that way is acceptable.
 
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dark_secrester

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Thanks everyone for the help!
Now I understand 😌

Please would a moderator change the topic title to 'chotto' instead of 'choto'

:D Pretty Pweeeese.

:D:D:D:D
 

quamp

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ちょっと can also be used to express that something is only slightly of that amount, but not a lot. E.g. - ちょっと重いですよ is "It's a little heavy."
 

nhk9

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Yes, matsu is "wait." Materu is "can wait." And yes, Tomii, the -te form of materu would be matete. Matte is the -te form of matsu, like I said, and it can be used to mean "wait (up)" or "hold on."

Zutto matta in most contexts would mean "I waited forever (lit. for quite a while/a long time)," although there are times when you can use the past form of a verb as a command, like chotto matta! or doita! doita! ("out of my way!"), but I'm not clear on the conditions when using it that way is acceptable.

I've never heard of chotto matta... is that some kind of namari? I am sure I've heard chotto matte! billion times over. :)

And also fyi, the -ita form normally comes after zutto. So definitely you'd hear zutto matteta (from zutto matte ita) more than zutto matta. That is -- "i had been waiting for a long time". Just my .02
 

Glenn

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I've never heard of chotto matta... is that some kind of namari? I am sure I've heard chotto matte! billion times over. :)

Not 訛り as far as I am aware, and I haven't heard it all that often, but I have heard it. Cf. Re:ちょっと待った

And also fyi, the -ita form normally comes after zutto. So definitely you'd hear zutto matteta (from zutto matte ita) more than zutto matta. That is -- "i had been waiting for a long time". Just my .02

That does make more sense. This reminds me of an instance in my early days of learning the language when I said to a Japanese guy いつも疲れました, and he said "it should be いつも疲れています," to which I replied, "ah, yeah, that makes sense," to which he then replied, "it does?" Made me lose a bit of confidence in my understanding, but now that I think about it I guess he found it strange that I would understand it even though he couldn't explain it. I could be wrong about that, but anyway.[/off topic]
 

Nagato

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I often heard "chotto matta". I don't know if that is a namari :)

I think we often heard or read some words in the te (teiru, teira) form than in their jishokei, like matte(i)ru, aishite(i)ru, shitte(i)ru. Therefore, some times we dont know or mistake their jishokei.
 

undrentide

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Zutto matta in most contexts would mean "I waited forever (lit. for quite a while/a long time)," although there are times when you can use the past form of a verb as a command, like chotto matta! or doita! doita! ("out of my way!"), but I'm not clear on the conditions when using it that way is acceptable.

Using the past form of a verb as a command sounds very strong compared with te form. (Not asking but more like ordering.)
Usually used by male, and I think it is rather an old usage though they are still in use today.

I'm also wondering in what situation/condition we can use it...
The two examples you mentioned (chotto matta! and doita doita!) are the ones most commonly used (especially "matta!"), what I can think of right now is
"kaetta kaetta!" (to drive people away, especially children)
"haitta haitta!" (come in, come in!)
"tabeta tabeta!" (to encourage someone to eat, "don't be shy, start eating!" for example)
"katta katta!" (vendors on the street to the people passing by)
... I realized that most of the time it is used in two.
:)
 

Damicci

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How about
ちょっと だめ ですね。 Meaning I can't do X.

Aさん: ディスカウントはいいですか?
Bさん: えっと、ちょっと。。。(ちょっとだめ)
Aさん: 分かりました、これがいいです。
Bさん: ありがとうございます。

I think that's right. Was a conversation from a Audio sample for Japanese Studies.
 

leonmarino

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Damicci;450704 said:
Aさん: ディスカウントはいいですか?
Bさん: えっと、ちょっと。。。(ちょっとだめ)
Aさん: 分かりました、これがいいです。
Bさん: ありがとうございます。
Hm.. I would think that instead of 「だめ」, 「むずかしい」 is more appropriate. It's from my limited personal experience in Japan though, when I asked some store clerk about something, which they declined by saying:

店員さん:「それは・・むずかしいですね・・」

At first I had trouble some trouble understanding it, because I wasn't used to not-hearing no as an answer. 😅
 

Damicci

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So here is the actual Dialogue:
お客: すみません、ちょっといいですか?

店員: はい、どうぞ

お客: この時計見せてください。

店員: どれですか?

お客: これです。これ。。。

店員: これですね、はいどうぞ。

お客: これはいくらですか?

店員: え。。こちらは1万8千円です。

お客: そうですか?これはどこの時計ですか?

店員: それはイタリアのです。

お客: あそうですか?それから、これも見せてください。

店員: あ、どうぞ、どうぞ。

お客: これはいくらですか?

店員: こちらは3万8千円。。あいいえ、いいえ、 すみません。3万円です。

お客: 3万円ですか? これはどこの時計ですか?

店員: これもイタリアのです。

お客: これもイタリアのですか?ディスカウント大丈夫ですか?

店員: ディスカウントですね、えっと、ちょっとだめですね。

お客: そうですか?はぁ、じゃこれをください。

店員: はい、ありがとうございます。
😅
 

Nagato

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In that case I think 難しい will be weird.
難しいですね。Well, that word is one of the words that Japanese use in the "ambiguous statement" (not to be rude, it's just my opinion).
IMHO 難しい is used when people able to do the thing, but they can't do it due to their convenience.

But from the above conversation, it seems the shop assistant can't give discount, just because there is no discount for that watch. So I think, he said 「ちょっとダメですね、この時計にはディスカウントが付いていません」. To me, ちょっとだめ still sounds ambiguous, though. So, ちょっと here is used to make the statement softer (polite).
 

Glenn

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Nagato;450762 said:
...ちょっと here is used to make the statement softer (polite).

Yeah, I believe that's the crux of the matter, as well as the above ちょっといいですか. It's used to soften a request or denial, one of those roundabout ways of saying things to avoid being too direct.
 

Elizabeth

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In that case I think 難しい will be weird.
難しいですね。Well, that word is one of the words that Japanese use in the "ambiguous statement" (not to be rude, it's just my opinion).
IMHO 難しい is used when people able to do the thing, but they can't do it due to their convenience.
Convenience is what people say when something is a pain to do because it doesn't increase their physical or material comfort. Muzukashii are challenging intellectual, psychological or practical challenges or endeavors that could prove to be literally impossible for nearly anyone attempting them.

Of course there are times of overlap between these in Japanese which may sound odd in English, such as referring to something that is difficult because it is confusing or systems inefficient for users to handle as "muzukashii"
Koko no bus system ha muzukashii desu, for instance. The bus system here is difficult (to navigate, understand, get around in....etc).

ちょっと難しい to me comes across softer and more sympathetic to the buyer (Now that would be just a little difficult). than ちょっとだめ (No, I really can't....) but both are probably OK.

Sorry, I've never been insistent, or stupid and rude, enough to try to get the price reduced on anything in Japan... 😅
 

undrentide

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Very often people just say 「それはちょっと・・・」 implying it is either very difficult or almost impossible, without uttering むずかしい or だめ, expecting the other party to understand it means NO.
😅
 

Elizabeth

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undrentide said:
Very often people just say 「それはちょっと・・・」 implying it is either very difficult or almost impossible, without uttering むずかしい or だめ, expecting the other party to understand it means NO.
そうですね。これは断りの返事として受取られます。
But...but.....という感じかな。

ええ、そうですが、ちょっと。。。。
そうですね。でも。。。。

とても便利な言葉ですね。

:oops:
 
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