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AのB[A simple question about this structure]

Kraise

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Lately while searching for listening material to improve my japanese, a friend introduced me a japanese animation called 「進撃の巨人」

At first it didnt get my attention, but something about the title of this animation got me bugged, i feel like( and checked in the internet to assure it tho) it should be understood as "the attack of the giants" or "the giant's attack", however, this structure is clearly changing the order in which the words are shown.

「進撃」attack/charge, comes first, followed by the possessive particle の、and then the subject 巨人 comes at the end.

If I was to reorganize or say such a thing by myself, I would rather say 「巨人が進撃(する)」.

My questions are:

1 - Is this structure related to the ones like 「髪の長い人」or 「必要のあるもの」?

2- If so, is there a gramatical definition to this? Or an explanation about what is happening in such construction and how it differs from a traditional "A ga B suru" or the common possessive clause "A no B desu「ex:直美のかさです」?

Thank you for the attention.
 
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Mike Cash

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Would 進撃の達人 similarly bother you?
 

Kraise

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Would 進撃の達人 similarly bother you?
Yes, at first sight...

The construction forces me to "translate" things to "the expert on/of attacks", but if it is the same as the original, It should be "the expert/master attacks"

@.@
 

Mike Cash

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But 進撃の達人 and 達人の進撃 are both possible and both mean different things. Get a grasp on that and it should then be easy to to re-substitute 巨人 and just keep in mind the usage is idiomatic.
 

Toritoribe

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1 - Is this structure related to the ones like 「髪の長い人」or 「必要のあるもの」?
The answer is no. That の is not the subject marker.
The English title "the attack of the giants" or "the giant's attack" is a free translation. 巨人の進撃 is equivalent to those titles, as you interpreted correctly.

The official English title is "Attack on Titan", BTW. To tell the truth, there's a problem on translating the title. 巨人 can mean both plural and singular in Japanese, and this concerns the story.
 

Kraise

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But 進撃の達人 and 達人の進撃 are both possible and both mean different things. Get a grasp on that and it should then be easy to to re-substitute 巨人 and just keep in mind the usage is idiomatic.
perhaps, the former 進撃の達人 , express a feeling of "the expert of the attacks", with a focus on the owner of something being talked about, be it a book (本の直美) or "attacks". Thus, allowing them to be rephrased to titles a little bit more natural in english.

While the 達人の進撃, is qualifying an actual thing, by giving it an owner/doer...

Is it anyhow right?
 

nekojita

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In AのB, A is always somehow modifying/qualifying/specifying B. Don't think of it as necessarily "possessive". It's not always about an owner and a thing, and when you swap it around it doesn't mean "B who owns A".

本の直美 therefore doesn't make sense in most contexts. But you might have 妹の直美 (not anything to do with Naomi's little sister).

The title is, as Toritoribe mentioned, ambiguous in the original and therefore an exact translation is not really possible (traduttore, traditore).
 

Kraise

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I see, my,example 本の直美、didnt really make much sense in The common used language, I was thinking about a fictional animation about a girl who loved books. Mimicking shingeki no kyojin's title style.

About your 妹の直美、Naomi herself is the youngest sister isnt she? Now that you talked about it, I recall seeing structures like this many times before, maybe I got confused by 進撃 and its するverb nature.
 

nekojita

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Yes, that would have to be the sort of context. To use another fictional example, there is a tennis manga/anime called "Baby Steps" whose main character is a super studious guy who is constantly taking notes/referring to his notes, even during games. He gets referred to as ノートのやつ and it later becomes a sort of nickname ノートの丸尾. So you can see it works in some cases - in that case, because his behaviour is weird enough that a lot of people just know him as "that guy with the notes".

Yes, 妹の直美 would be "my little sister, Naomi".

I think you probably just got mislead by the translation not matching the original Japanese. Your initial instinct of "this doesn't match up" was right. In general, titles are commonly loosely translated or completely rewritten. Sometimes it's just not possible to get across the feel of the original in a succinct way. So "Anne of Green Gables" becomes 赤毛のアン, and so on.
 

Kraise

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I Got it, thank you all for taking your time to help
 
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