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Tokyo Olympics 2020

nice gaijin

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"I like foreigners"... just not when there are too many of them around and they're too loud and don't act like Japanese people...

yikes, this is embarrassing. The Olympics are going to be such fun!
 

Mike Cash

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"I like foreigners"... just not when there are too many of them around and they're too loud and don't act like Japanese people...

yikes, this is embarrassing. The Olympics are going to be such fun!
I don't know which I dread more, the Olympics themselves or the next four years of intense navel-gazing build-up to the Olympics. I think even people who were thrilled when Tokyo was announced are going to experience overload and burn-out and be thoroughly sick of hearing about it well before they start. Last Sunday NHK ran twelve straight hours of Tokyo Olympics programming....
 

nice gaijin

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I don't know which I dread more, the Olympics themselves or the next four years of intense navel-gazing build-up to the Olympics. I think even people who were thrilled when Tokyo was announced are going to experience overload and burn-out and be thoroughly sick of hearing about it well before they start. Last Sunday NHK ran twelve straight hours of Tokyo Olympics programming....
12 hours, geez! they're already trying to make people sick of it?

I think it's going to be the olympic hangover: once they blow through and move on to the next host city, Tokyo will realize that the supposed benefits of hosting the olympics were a boondoggle, and all the infrastructure and facilities they built for the event will be underutilized and eventually fall into disuse and disrepair. The concept of the olympics is very inspiring and high-minded and wonderful, the reality of it is corrupt and depressing.
 

Lothor

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Last Sunday NHK ran twelve straight hours of Tokyo Olympics programming....
NHK have always been like that. I remember in 2004 when there was a major fatal accident at a nuclear power plant in Fukui, that evening they reported extensively on the build-up to the Athens games (not even the games themselves!) before bothering to tell viewers what had happened at the plant. I stopped watching them years ago.
 
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I just shared this news with my wife. All she said was "I'm sure he meant loud Chinese tourists, and not just all foreigners".

I admit, she can be "Japanese style racist" at times. How have Japanese in general responded to this news?
 
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Tokyo will realize that the supposed benefits of hosting the olympics were a boondoggle, and all the infrastructure and facilities they built for the event will be underutilized and eventually fall into disuse and disrepair.
Remember how Tokyo already hosted Olympics in the past? Most of the infrastructure is already in place. The new ones such as the Asia headquarters and new stations were already planned to be built and just use the Olympics for the favorable timing. They'd be necessary with or without the Olympics.

As for the facilities, close to half of them will be pre-existing ones and a good chunk of the new ones are only temporary.

I personally think the Olympics will do great for the economy as long as they don't go crazy with the budget, that's where the real risk is.
 

nice gaijin

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Remember how Tokyo already hosted Olympics in the past? Most of the infrastructure is already in place. The new ones such as the Asia headquarters and new stations were already planned to be built and just use the Olympics for the favorable timing. They'd be necessary with or without the Olympics.

As for the facilities, close to half of them will be pre-existing ones and a good chunk of the new ones are only temporary.
I'm aware it happened, but I don't remember because I wasn't alive in 1964. That infrastructure is now 50 years old, and many of the venues are being rebuilt. There might be exceptions where benefits to the host's infrastructure were more widely felt and built-to-last, but when you look at modern olympics, the expansions are for the benefit of the games and any lasting benefit to the city is incidental. I've been to some of the things built for Beijing's olympic games, here's what their investment got them: Decrepit: Four Years After Hosting the Beijing Olympics, This Is What China’s $40B Investment Looks Like | TheBlaze.com

http://www.s-ge.com/de/filefield-private/files/167599/field_blog_public_files/64649
This paper talks about the "need for action" a bit and highlights the hopes and dreams that the Olympics would be a catalyst that could launch Tokyo out of the economic slump and endless recession. That's the concept of the Olympics that people want to believe in. The reality sets in when you realize the article is outdated because it was published before the Tokyo committee pulled a bait and switch on Zaha Hadid and railroaded her winning design after using it to secure their bid to host the Olympics in the first place. Not to mention the whole fiasco surrounding the 2020 logo. When it comes down to it the Olympics serves itself, not the host cities, and certainly not the people that help make it happen.

Here are some more examples of olympic venues that stand as a testament to what a raw deal it is for the host cities:
Olympic Venues: Then vs. Now | Indie88
What 10 Previous Olympic Venues Look Like Today | Mental Floss

This article breaks down all the venues from the 1996 Atlanta olympics and what's happened to them. It ranges from "modified for continued use" to "slated for demolition," "made into a parking lot" or "torn down for a new venue to be built." This is all in the past 20 years.
Atlanta Olympic venues, 20 years later (photos) – OlympicTalk

How much of that 1964 infrastructure do we expect the 2020 olympics to rely on again? Is that really a viable rationale?

I personally think the Olympics will do great for the economy as long as they don't go crazy with the budget, that's where the real risk is.
The cost of the 2020 games is already astronomical: Tokyo’s 2020 Olympic building plans called out for being exorbitantly expensive - Curbed
 
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That infrastructure is now 50 years old, and many of the venues are being rebuilt.
With proper care and maintenance, they should last well over a hundred years. 50 years is perfectly fine.

There might be exceptions where benefits to the host's infrastructure were more widely felt and built-to-last, but when you look at modern olympics, the expansions are for the benefit of the games and any lasting benefit to the city is incidental. I've been to some of the things built for Beijing's olympic games, here's what their investment got them: Decrepit: Four Years After Hosting the Beijing Olympics, This Is What China’s $40B Investment Looks Like | TheBlaze.com
Apples and oranges. You can't compare a mature city in a first world country like Tokyo to Beijing. Tokyo has a lot more in common with London and the Olympics worked out great for them.

When it comes down to it the Olympics serves itself, not the host cities, and certainly not the people that help make it happen.
A major part of the current administration's strategy for economic revival is to significantly increase the number of foreign tourists and the Olympics are one of the tools that will likely make that happen. The whole point is to get people to come over and continue to do so. People getting screwed over logo design might suck from a moral standpoint but it doesn't matter to the economy.

How much of that 1964 infrastructure do we expect the 2020 olympics to rely on again? Is that really a viable rationale?
東京オリンピック 競技場 会場 最新情報 東京ベイゾーン ヘリテッジゾーン 見直し 整備計画 仮設施設  - “メディア・クローズアップ”放送・通信・ICT・メディア最新情報-国際メディアサービスシステム研究所
"競技開催計画では、既存施設15か所、新設施設22か所(恒久施設11 仮設施設11)"
15 out of 37 are preexisting, 22 are new but half of them are only temporary. So basically they're building 4 fewer (permanent) new venues than at the last Olympics.

Your article might be recent but the figures it quotes are old.
東京オリンピック 競技場 会場 最新情報 東京ベイゾーン ヘリテッジゾーン 見直し 整備計画 仮設施設  - “メディア・クローズアップ”放送・通信・ICT・メディア最新情報-国際メディアサービスシステム研究所
5th graph from the top. Your article says the current estimates are 4584兆円 but that's before they were revised. They're currently at 2241兆円.

Would the article's author still call the cost "exorbitantly expensive" if she knew the actual figures were half that?
 
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nice gaijin

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With proper care and maintenance, they should last well over a hundred years. 50 years is perfectly fine.

Apples and oranges. You can't compare a mature city in a first world country like Tokyo to Beijing. Tokyo has a lot more in common with London and the Olympics worked out great for them.

A major part of the current administration's strategy for economic revival is to significantly increase the number of foreign tourists and the Olympics are one of the tools that will likely make that happen. The whole point is to get people to come over and continue to do so. People getting screwed over logo design might suck from a moral standpoint but it doesn't matter to the economy.

東京オリンピック 競技場 会場 最新情報 東京ベイゾーン ヘリテッジゾーン 見直し 整備計画 仮設施設  - “メディア・クローズアップ”放送・通信・ICT・メディア最新情報-国際メディアサービスシステム研究所
"競技開催計画では、既存施設15か所、新設施設22か所(恒久施設11 仮設施設11)"
15 out of 37 are preexisting, 22 are new but half of them are only temporary. So basically they're building 4 fewer (permanent) new venues than at the last Olympics.
I don't expect anything built today to last over a hundred years. The document I linked from Switzerland Global Enterprise described the infrastructure built out in the 60's as deteriorating. Either way, the olympics does make a good excuse for the city to invest enormous sums of money, it's just a matter of whether those funds are spent for the benefit of the people. As it's been shown time and again, the olympics is just a grab-bag for developers (in collusion with the local authority) to seize, at the expense of the people.

It wasn't just a logo designer that got shafted by the Tokyo Committee, the architect behind the centerpiece of their bid was hustled out of the project, partly it seems to bring down that astronomical price tag. The past two years have been shady as hell while all this has gone down.

The Olympics itself will definitely bring tourists, but will it have a sustainable impact on that industry? I have my doubts.


Your article might be recent but the figures it quotes are old.
東京オリンピック 競技場 会場 最新情報 東京ベイゾーン ヘリテッジゾーン 見直し 整備計画 仮設施設  - “メディア・クローズアップ”放送・通信・ICT・メディア最新情報-国際メディアサービスシステム研究所
5th graph from the top. Your article says the current estimates are 4584兆円 but that's before they were revised. They're currently at 2241兆円.

Would the article's author still call the cost "exorbitantly expensive" if she knew the actual figures were half that?
Hmm this is interesting, so these are the results of Governor Koike's direction to look for ways to cut costs (presumably beyond strong-arming the architect out of the job)? Were the numbers updated since the articles I linked were published, or were they actually using outdated sources? If the new plan still included building entire new islands for canoe slalom, I could think of some synonyms for exorbitantly expensive.
 

thomas

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Interesting development here:

IOC may move some Tokyo 2020 Olympic events to South Korea | Sport | The Guardian

The International Olympic Committee is considering moving the rowing and canoeing events at the Tokyo 2020 Olympics to South Korea in an attempt to cut soaring costs, according to Japanese media reports.

Depriving Japan of the events risks provoking a backlash from the Tokyo 2020 organisers, and would make a mockery of the city’s vow to hold a “compact” Games.

Kyodo News and the Asahi Shimbun on Tuesday cited unnamed sources as saying that the events could be held in the South Korean city of Chungju – one of the venues for the 2014 Asian Games – if organisers and Tokyo’s governor, Yuriko Koike, fail to agree on a site in Japan.
Perhaps just a little pressure on Mrs Koike?
 
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