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The school that I work at with- its school song Lyrics with translation

cloa513

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I know the rules say no lyrics unless you have done a serious attempt- I hope this counts as serious.

Is this literally right?

Figuratively/ metaphorically what are they saying here.

Higashi Junior School’s Song with literal translation (直訳)

秩父の山並 そびえ立ち

Chichibu’s mountain range stands towering over the surrounds

 富士の峯 また揺るぎなし

Fuji’s peak is still solid

見よ その姿 仰ぎつつ

Still looking up at its figure

 あすの時代を飛びかける

(文芸翻訳 ) Keeps going into the future (I especially am unclear about this line)

若きかりがね ここに育つ

Young turkey raised here

 東中 川越東中学校

荒川流れて 果てしなく

Arakawa river flows eternally

 入間の水 また休みなし

Iruma (river)’s water has no rest

ああ その行く手 望みつつ

One’s way, wish continues

 真理求めて ひたすらに

Set on wanting the truth

日々を悔いなく 学び励む

People have no regrets from striving and learning

 東中 川越東中学校


ひらめく えんじの 旗の下

Kindergartenners hit on a good idea under the flag

 若き夢 また限りなし

Young persons dream still boundless

さあ そのひとみ 輝かし

The pupil of your eye is promising

 進め 緑の風の中

Advance in the early summer wind

未来めざして 力強く

Forcefully aim at the future

 東中 川越東中学校
 

Toritoribe

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見よ その姿 仰ぎつつ
Still looking up at its figure

 あすの時代を飛びかける
(文芸翻訳 ) Keeps going into the future (I especially am unclear about this line)

若きかりがね ここに育つ
Young turkey raised here
These three lines are a single sentence, and it's an inversion. The object of 見よ is the rest of the sentence; その姿(を)仰ぎつつあすの時代を飛びかける若きかりがね(が)ここに育つ(のを)見よ.
飛びかける is 飛び駆ける.
あすの時代を飛びかける modifies 若きかりがね.
かりがね means lesser white-fronted goose, not turkey.

ああ その行く手 望みつつ
One’s way, wish continues
望む means "to see" here.
のぞむ【望む】
3 〔眺める〕see; 〔見渡す〕((場所を主語にして)) command ((a view))
湖はここから望むと実に美しい
The lake seen from here is really beautiful.
この部屋から松島の素晴らしい景色が望まれる
This room commands a splendid view of Matsushima.
望むの英語・英訳 - goo辞書 英和和英

日々を悔いなく 学び励む
People have no regrets from striving and learning
学び励む is the predicative.
悔いなく is an adverbial phrase.
The subject is students.

ひらめく えんじの 旗の下
Kindergartenners hit on a good idea under the flag
ひらめく【閃く】
2 〔ひらひらする〕
風にひらめく旗
a flag fluttering [waving] in the wind
閃くの英語・英訳 - goo辞書 英和和英
えんじ is 臙脂 here, not 園児.

さあ そのひとみ 輝かし
The pupil of your eye is promising

 進め 緑の風の中
Advance in the early summer wind
輝かし is connected to 進め; 輝かし進め/輝かせて進め.
 

cloa513

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These three lines are a single sentence, and it's an inversion. The object of 見よ is the rest of the sentence; その姿(を)仰ぎつつあすの時代を飛びかける若きかりがね(が)ここに育つ(のを)見よ.
飛びかける is 飛び駆ける.
あすの時代を飛びかける modifies 若きかりがね.
かりがね means lesser white-fronted goose, not turkey.


望む means "to see" here.

望むの英語・英訳 - goo辞書 英和和英


学び励む is the predicative.
悔いなく is an adverbial phrase.
The subject is students.



閃くの英語・英訳 - goo辞書 英和和英
えんじ is 臙脂 here, not 園児.


輝かし is connected to 進め; 輝かし進め/輝かせて進め.
Thanks for your reply- a lot to consider in correctly literally translating. Any thoughts on the figurative use of language. Here is link to wiki page for the school.
川越市立東中学校 - Wikipedia
 

Majestic

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Can you explain a bit about what you are getting at with regard to literal vs. figurative translation? Obviously word-for-word translation from Japanese to English (and vice-versa) produces strange, unintended results due to the different structure, different inferences, different cultural references, etc... Therefore, I think you just mean "correct translation" - but within the parameters of correct translation there is a spectrum of possibilities from technically correct (but unintentionally obscure) to lucid (with some adaptations for comprehension).

For example, in the case of your school song, there is the reference to the bird, the "lesser white-fronted goose", which, in English, sounds quite technical and overly ornithological, and therefore not very appropriate for a school song. If you are striving to render the poetry of the original song into equally poetic English, you will have to make a slight sacrifice for the sake of your reader. The trick is in making as small a sacrifice as possible, to achieve maximum clarity. In the school song, maybe "wild geese" or something like that would be sufficiently accurate without causing the reader to run for "Audubon's Bird Encyclopedia".
Is this kind of close to what you are getting at, or have I misread your intentions?
 

cloa513

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Can you explain a bit about what you are getting at with regard to literal vs. figurative translation? Obviously word-for-word translation from Japanese to English (and vice-versa) produces strange, unintended results due to the different structure, different inferences, different cultural references, etc... Therefore, I think you just mean "correct translation" - but within the parameters of correct translation there is a spectrum of possibilities from technically correct (but unintentionally obscure) to lucid (with some adaptations for comprehension).

For example, in the case of your school song, there is the reference to the bird, the "lesser white-fronted goose", which, in English, sounds quite technical and overly ornithological, and therefore not very appropriate for a school song. If you are striving to render the poetry of the original song into equally poetic English, you will have to make a slight sacrifice for the sake of your reader. The trick is in making as small a sacrifice as possible, to achieve maximum clarity. In the school song, maybe "wild geese" or something like that would be sufficiently accurate without causing the reader to run for "Audubon's Bird Encyclopedia".
Is this kind of close to what you are getting at, or have I misread your intentions?
I am not intending to produce some poetry- only its meaning. By figurative- I mean what is the song writer implying to Japanese singers and listeners. What does a lesser wild-geese imply?
 

Majestic

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Well this is a case where the author isn't trying to imply anything other than the bird that is native to the area. In the original Japanese it sounds fine (karigane) and I'm sure for the people of the area that word alone evokes a certain feeling of identity or pride or nostalgia for the region. Therefore, its a good fit for a local school song (it wouldn't be a good fit for a school song from, say, Okinawa). Unfortunately there is no elegant translation into English other than the somewhat clumsy Lesser White-Footed Goose or its scientific name, Anser erythropus. So, the translator has to decide from these two technically correct choices, (both of which are accurate, but probably will be too technical for the average reader of English) or some other choice.
 

Toritoribe

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Thanks for your reply- a lot to consider in correctly literally translating. Any thoughts on the figurative use of language. Here is link to wiki page for the school.
川越市立東中学校 - Wikipedia
The lyrics is very straightforward. It seems to me that your "figurative" impression comes from your misinterpretation/mistranslation. For instance, "Kindergartenners hit on a good idea under the flag" doesn't make sense even in Japanese. However, I can easily guess that the concept color of the school must be deep red from the line "under the waving deep red flag", even though I don't know about the school at all.
若きかりがね is a metaphor that represents students, so "young birds" is enough to convey the nuance, isn't it?
 

Majestic

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So it is figurative... wow, I swung hard and missed with that one! Is that a common metaphor for young people, or do you think it is at all related to the location?
 

cloa513

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Well I thought even the literal elements of the song might have figurative elements as well- even if some the translation choices were bad.
 

Toritoribe

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Is that a common metaphor for young people, or do you think it is at all related to the location?
It's the latter. Another bird would be used in another place.
 

cloa513

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These three lines are a single sentence, and it's an inversion. The object of 見よ is the rest of the sentence; その姿(を)仰ぎつつあすの時代を飛びかける若きかりがね(が)ここに育つ(のを)見よ.
飛びかける is 飛び駆ける.
あすの時代を飛びかける modifies 若きかりがね.
かりがね means lesser white-fronted goose, not turkey.


望む means "to see" here.

望むの英語・英訳 - goo辞書 英和和英


学び励む is the predicative.
悔いなく is an adverbial phrase.
The subject is students.



閃くの英語・英訳 - goo辞書 英和和英
えんじ is 臙脂 here, not 園児.


輝かし is connected to 進め; 輝かし進め/輝かせて進め.
I think this one is better rather hurtling along the ground the bird is soaring not that it really matters. I didn't realise there were so many かける
飛び翔る
 

Toritoribe

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かける【翔る/駆ける】の意味 - goo国語辞書

駆ける is not used only for "to run". As you can see in the dictionary I linked above, 翔る is not in the Joyo kanji list. ("×" on the upper left of the kanji shows it.) In these cases, 駆ける is usually used to represent all the meanings of かける, just like 取る is used also for 摂る "to ingest" or 盗る "to steal".
So, what is your final translation of the lyrics? Also, did you read my reply in your another thread? Any response?
 

cloa513

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This is very similar to what I ended up with.

Higashi Junior School’s Song with literal translation (直訳)

秩父の山並 そびえ立ち

Chichibu’s mountain range stands towering over the surrounds

 富士の峯 また揺るぎなし

Fuji’s peak is still solid

見よ その姿 仰ぎつつ

 あすの時代を飛びかける

若きかりがね ここに育つ

Look at the figure of the soaring lesser white-fronted goose

 東中 川越東中学校

荒川流れて 果てしなく

Arakawa river flows eternally

 入間の水 また休みなし

Iruma (river)’s water has no rest

ああ その行く手 望みつつ

See one’s path

 真理求めて ひたすらに

Set on wanting the truth

日々を悔いなく 学び励む

Students regretlessly endeavor to learn

 東中 川越東中学校


ひらめく えんじの 旗の下

Under a billowing red flag

 若き夢 また限りなし

Young persons have boundless dreams

さあ そのひとみ 輝かし

The pupil of your eye is promising

 進め 緑の風の中

Advance in the early summer wind

未来めざして 力強く

Forcefully aim at the future

 東中 川越東中学校
 

Toritoribe

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見よ その姿 仰ぎつつ

 あすの時代を飛びかける

若きかりがね ここに育つ

Look at the figure of the soaring lesser white-fronted goose
その refers to the mountains, not the birds.
You missed 育つ. The structure is 若きかりがね(が)ここに育つ(のを)見よ, as I wrote in my previous post.
あすの時代を飛びかける modifies 若きかりがね. This is not the current action. It's future tense since the time they will fly is in あすの時代.
 

johnnyG

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How about "our beloved geese" (or something similar) instead of actually naming them? Our would seem to make them the ones connected to the area (local) and so ID them satisfactorily.
 

cloa513

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I will try again on Friday when I have the whole day free.
 

cloa513

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I don't think I will do any more work on this song unless I can help with the figurative elements such as rivers running eternally.



Higashi Junior High School Song Translated


秩父の山並 そびえ立ち

Chichibu’s mountain range stands towering over the surrounds

富士の峯 また揺るぎなし

見よ その姿 仰ぎつつ

Look up and revere Mount Fuji’s enduring presence

あすの時代を飛びかける

若きかりがね ここに育つ

Look in the future when you see the figure of locally raised soaring lesser white-fronted geese.

東中 川越東中学校

Higashi Junior High School

荒川流れて 果てしなく

Arakawa river flows eternally

入間の水 また休みなし

Iruma (river)’s water has no rest

ああ その行く手 望みつつ

See their life path

 真理求めて ひたすらに

And set on wanting the truth

日々を悔いなく 学び励む

Students regretlessly endeavor to learn

 東中 川越東中学校

Higashi Junior High School

ひらめく えんじの 旗の下

Under a billowing red flag

 若き夢 また限りなし

Young persons have boundless dreams

さあ そのひとみ 輝かし

And the pupil of their eyes twinkles promisingly

進め 緑の風の中

So they advance in the early summer wind

未来めざして 力強く

And forcefully aim for the future

 東中 川越東中学校

Higashi Junior High School
 
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